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Thread: Don't read if you can't handle something you'll probably find offensive.

  1. #1

    Don't read if you can't handle something you'll probably find offensive.

    I warned you.

    Below is a post from FB that challenges the origins of 'the "Word of Faith" doctrine'. In fact it says it's a heresy. I'm just wondering how WOF believers would respond. Biblically of course, not emotionally.
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    FYI my only conscious interaction with it is trying to read Kenyon's "What Happened from the Cross to the Throne" (my original Pastor was a Kenyon fan), and going to a church camp where the guest was Roy Hicks Sr and buying his "Use It or Lose It: The Word of Faith" which I read many times. (Use it or Loose it: Hicks, Roy H.: 9780892740024: Amazon.com: Books). I must admit it psyched out people when in response to "you're getting sunburnt" I'd say "by Jesus' stripes I've been healed".
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    During my lifetime, I have personally experienced the way heresy spreads and infects the Church overall.
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    Decades earlier, a man named Kenneth Hagin wrote a book. In it, he lied and said Jesus personally taught him what came to be known as the "Word of Faith" doctrine. He was the conduit Satan used to import the notion of "speaking things into existence" into Christianity.
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    It wasn't until AFTER that teaching was imported into Christianity that Christians who had accepted it began to find proof texts to try to justify it as orthodox Christian teaching. The reality is that is was never taught or preached anywhere in the history of Christianity.
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    There is no portion of scripture that even implies that YHWH endowed humans with the ability to bring things into existence with words in the way He can.
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    This kind of teaching and language is now being used OUTSIDE of the tongue talker's Word of Faith / Charismatic circles. That's a literal example in YOUR lifetime of a new heresy being invented and how the rest of the Church was infected.

  2. #2
    You should never have left the WOF teachings. I would be dead without Hagin's teachings on the Authority of the believer.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by LionHeart View Post
    You should never have left the WOF teachings. I would be dead without Hagin's teachings on the Authority of the believer.
    a) I was never in it.

    b) if you're saved you'd be in heaven.

    c) you haven't really answered the question.

    d) I bought and read secular books saying the same things when I was pretending to be an Amway distributor. If it works for non-Christians it can't be called Word of "Faith" can it as they don't have any?

  4. #4

  5. #5
    Kenneth Hagin learned from a number of sources, the first one being the Bible illuminated by the Holy Spirit which brought him off of his death bed at the age of 16. Then he started learning from his Assembly of God mentors Mom & Pop Goodwin, who introduced him to the ministries of Smith Wigglesworth, F. F. Bosworth, Raymond T. Richey, John G. Lake, and Dr. P. C. Nelson. Years later he had visions and visitations with further revelation. He never taught "speak things into existence". He taught that the faith confession of God's Word brings His promises into reality. Rom. 10:9,10 tells us that confession is how you get saved, so it's kind of hard to dismiss it biblicallly. Whether you agree with his teaching or not, it's not heresy as it violates none of the essential doctrines of the faith. Your FB friend is quite frankly an ignoramus on the topic.

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  7. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Jew and Greek View Post
    Kenneth Hagin learned from a number of sources, the first one being the Bible illuminated by the Holy Spirit which brought him off of his death bed at the age of 16. Then he started learning from his Assembly of God mentors Mom & Pop Goodwin, who introduced him to the ministries of Smith Wigglesworth, F. F. Bosworth, Raymond T. Richey, John G. Lake, and Dr. P. C. Nelson. Years later he had visions and visitations with further revelation. He never taught "speak things into existence". He taught that the faith confession of God's Word brings His promises into reality. Rom. 10:9,10 tells us that confession is how you get saved, so it's kind of hard to dismiss it biblicallly. Whether you agree with his teaching or not, it's not heresy as it violates none of the essential doctrines of the faith. Your FB friend is quite frankly an ignoramus on the topic.
    There's a lot here but allow me to pick out two bits:

    Quote Originally Posted by Jew and Greek View Post
    He taught that the faith confession of God's Word brings His promises into reality. Rom. 10:9,10 tells us that confession is how you get saved, so it's kind of hard to dismiss it biblically.
    What portions of Scripture can we exegesis that clearly shows that "the faith confession of God's Word brings His promises into reality"? Googling the promises of God gives results that aren't very specific. But we know that one of Jesus' promises was persecutions (Mk 10:30). Do WOF preachers preach that we should confess that in faith? Also, as salvation comes immediately do all the other promises come immediately. If not where does Scripture say this?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jew and Greek View Post
    Kenneth Hagin learned from a number of sources, the first one being the Bible illuminated by the Holy Spirit which brought him off of his death bed at the age of 16. Then he started learning from his Assembly of God mentors Mom & Pop Goodwin, who introduced him to the ministries of Smith Wigglesworth, F. F. Bosworth, Raymond T. Richey, John G. Lake, and Dr. P. C. Nelson. Years later he had visions and visitations with further revelation.
    The site linked below says that "In April 1933 during a dramatic conversion experience, he reported dying three times in 10 minutes, each time seeing the horrors of hell and then returning to life.

    In August 1934, Rev. Hagin was miraculously healed, raised off a deathbed by the power of God and the revelation of faith in God's Word. Jesus appeared to Rev. Hagin eight times over the next several years in visions that changed the course of his ministry
    ."

    Well Joseph Smith said he experienced a series of visions, including one in 1820 during which he saw "two personages" (whom he eventually described as God the Father and Jesus Christ), and another in 1823 (of) an angel)

    And Mary Baker Eddy who described Christian Science as a return to "primitive Christianity and its lost element of healing" claimed to have multiple visions.

    Muhammad claims to have seen "The angel Gabriel in human form"

    Then we have multiple Catholics claiming to see visions of Mary and Jesus and various saints. Too many to mention actually.

    Finally, this year we had well known people including some who would be considered leaders in the WOF movement (1) claim to have been spoken to by God about C-19 and (2) claim to have been spoken to by God about the election.

    All the above were false.

    So what evidence do we have that would affirm to us that it is safe and Biblical for us to believe that Kenneth Hagin went to hell several times and later had Jesus appear to him multiple times?


    Kenneth E. & Oretha Hagin Founder of Rhema Christian Faith Ministry

  8. #7
    What portions of Scripture can we exegesis that clearly shows that "the faith confession of God's Word brings His promises into reality"? Googling the promises of God gives results that aren't very specific. But we know that one of Jesus' promises was persecutions (Mk 10:30). Do WOF preachers preach that we should confess that in faith? Also, as salvation comes immediately do all the other promises come immediately. If not where does Scripture say this?
    No offense, but this is juvenile. Why would anybody want persecution? We accept it because Jesus said it, just like the Bible says that death comes to all, but nobody wants to die. But we all know that health is better than sickness and prosperity is better than poverty. Health and prosperity were a part of the Old Covenant if they were obedient. Heb. 8:6 says we have a better covenant. As for Kenneth Hagin's accounts of leaving his body, I guess we don't know if those stories are true. I accept them as true because I saw how he lived his life. I've never known a more focused, consistent, dedicated, God-fearing man in my life.

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Jew and Greek View Post
    Why would anybody want persecution?
    They wouldn't. But when someone teaches that the faith confession of God's Word brings His promises into reality it seems selfish to me to only go for the promises that make one feel comfortable. After all Jesus said we're to deny ourselves and follow Him.

  10. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Jew and Greek View Post
    As for Kenneth Hagin's accounts of leaving his body, I guess we don't know if those stories are true. I accept them as true because I saw how he lived his life. I've never known a more focused, consistent, dedicated, God-fearing man in my life.
    And therein is why we had to have the Reformation. People believing stuff based on what they think of the person saying it rather than what the Bible says.

  11. #10
    Senior Member Cardinal TT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FunFromOz View Post
    And therein is why we had to have the Reformation. People believing stuff based on what they think of the person saying it rather than what the Bible says.
    Your comment would have merit but it's meaningless when you favour Calvinists with your bias

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