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Senior Member
If we look at the details, there should be hundreds of thousands in the bosom of Abraham and hundreds of millions in the other compartment. The idea of the rich man being able to have a conversation with specifically Abraham without being held back from the edge of the chasm by the others in the same area or their making too much noise for the conversation to be heard seems far fetched. Why would God work a miracle down there so that those two would be able to have a conversation ? It makes little sense.
Let's say there were 500 million people in Hades proper and that there were about 4 per square meter. That would place the middle of the group about 3 miles from the edge. Who let the rich man within hearing distance of Abraham ? Never mind the need for bodies to make sound and air for sound to travel.
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Senior Member
Originally Posted by
Colonel
If we look at the details, there should be hundreds of thousands in the bosom of Abraham and hundreds of millions in the other compartment. The idea of the rich man being able to have a conversation with specifically Abraham without being held back from the edge of the chasm by the others in the same area or their making too much noise for the conversation to be heard seems far fetched. Why would God work a miracle down there so that those two would be able to have a conversation ? It makes little sense.
Let's say there were 500 million people in Hades proper and that there were about 4 per square meter. That would place the middle of the group about 3 miles from the edge. Who let the rich man within hearing distance of Abraham ? Never mind the need for bodies to make sound and air for sound to travel.
That is the danger of human reasoning....our minds cannot comprehend as hell is a place of spirits
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Senior Member
Originally Posted by
Cardinal TT
That is the danger of human reasoning....our minds cannot comprehend as hell is a place of spirits
It's funny then that people insist that the fire of hell (whichever version) has to be "literal fire". Especially when the testimony of scripture is that the sinners react to the manifestation of the fire that God revealed himself as, like this :
Isaiah 33:14 The sinners in Zion are afraid; Fearfulness has seized the hypocrites: “Who among us shall dwell with the devouring fire? Who among us shall dwell with everlasting burnings?”
What is the context ? Look at verse 12 :
12 Like thorns cut up they shall be burned in the fire.
Compare to :
Luke 3:17 His winnowing fan is in His hand, and He will thoroughly clean out His threshing floor, and gather the wheat into His barn; but the chaff He will burn with unquenchable fire.
Heb 6:8 but if it bears thorns and briers, it is rejected and near to being cursed, whose end is to be burned.
Our God is a consuming fire. What happens when he shows himself from the side of wrath and that only ? He remains a consuming fire.
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Senior Member
Originally Posted by
Colonel
It's funny then that people insist that the fire of hell (whichever version) has to be "literal fire".
The fire of hell is literal in the spirit realm......it can be felt, heard and smelt
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Senior Member
Originally Posted by
Cardinal TT
The fire of hell is literal in the spirit realm......it can be felt, heard and smelt
But what is its origin or substance ?
And which version of hell are you talking about ?
Exod 24:17 The sight of the glory of the Lord was like a consuming fire on the top of the mountain in the eyes of the children of Israel.
Exod 19:18 Now Mount Sinai was completely in smoke, because the Lord descended upon it in fire. Its smoke ascended like the smoke of a furnace, and the whole mountain quaked greatly.
Exod 15:7 And in the greatness of Your excellence You have overthrown those who rose against You; You sent forth Your wrath; It consumed them like stubble.
Exod 32:10 Now therefore, let Me alone, that My wrath may burn hot against them and I may consume them.
Zeph 1:18 In the day of the Lord’s wrath;
But the whole land shall be devoured
By the fire of His jealousy,
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Senior Member
The above first 2 verses are not talking about hell....it is God manifesting as fire
The third verse is when God consumed by fire some of the rebellious.
Hell is a place of unsaved human spirits. It is just as real as this natural earth. The spirits can see, hear, feel and experience judgement fire
Are you saying unsaved human spirits when they die get consumed by fire and have no consciousness
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Senior Member
Originally Posted by
Cardinal TT
The above first 2 verses are not talking about hell....it is God manifesting as fire
The third verse is when God consumed by fire some of the rebellious.
Hell is a place of unsaved human spirits. It is just as real as this natural earth. The spirits can see, hear, feel and experience judgement fire
Are you saying unsaved human spirits get consumed and die and have no consciousness
No, I'm saying that they experience the consuming fire of God's wrath and hot anger, the everlasting burning, the unquenchable fire. The fire that should have made them alive and burned with love for them, instead he turns it against them in anger. Our God is the most dangerous being that could exist, except to those who are in right standing with him.
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Senior Member
Zephaniah 1 (Amplified)
17 I will bring such distress on men
that they will walk like the blind [unable to find a way of escape],
Because they have sinned against the Lord;
Their blood will be poured out like dust [and trampled underfoot],
And their flesh like dung.
18 Neither their silver nor their gold
Will be able to rescue them
On the day of the Lord’s indignation and wrath.
And the whole earth will be consumed
In the fire of His jealous wrath,
For He shall make a full and complete end,
Indeed a terrifying one,
Of all the inhabitants of the earth.
That doesn't mean that they cease to exist. It just means that everything else than that comes to an end.
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Senior Member
Originally Posted by
Colonel
No, I'm saying that they experience the consuming fire of God's wrath and hot anger, the everlasting burning, the unquenchable fire. The fire that should have made them alive and burned with love for them, instead he turns it against them in anger. Our God is the most dangerous being that could exist, except to those who are in right standing with him.
I don't think anyone disagrees with what you wrote above
Hell is still a literal place where unsaved human spirits go to and suffer punishment by fire
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Senior Member
Originally Posted by
Cardinal TT
I don't think anyone disagrees with what you wrote above
Hell is still a literal place where unsaved human spirits go to and suffer punishment by fire
The fire of God's jealous wrath, per Zephaniah 1:18
His jealousy against sin
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