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Thread: Did Jesus die Spiritually???

  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by LionHeart View Post
    I agree with Hagin on the basics of faith, but I reject the error of Jesus went to hell.
    Yes, I can see that.
    This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity (futility) of their mind, having the understanding darkened...
    (Ephesians 4:17-18)

    Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly...
    (Psalm 1)

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by GodismyJudge View Post
    If you want to talk personal experience, I too had a questions.

    As a very young Spirit-Filled christian I attended a church (denominational) that took Communion every 3rfd Sunday or something.

    I asked the Lord during communion, what does this really mean?

    Quicker that you could snap your fingers, He was able to make me know that He poured out EVERY DROP of His life for me.

    I cannot put into words other that to say that He held NOTHING back.

    I mean words cannot even express the totality of it.

    .

    How about addressing the Scriptures?
    If I had time I would. But they are out of context to defend the Kenyonism of Jesus died spiritually. A text taken out of context can be use as a pretext. This teaching is found nowhere in Christianity except WOF ! It is false doctrine. Luther did not believe this at all either....

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by LionHeart View Post
    ...When I later heard this taught in WOF there was always an anger at those that would disagree with them and this teaching. I think the Holy Spirit is trying to get to them with the inner witness and they are overriding Him therefore the anger.
    That is actually really quite ironic.

    In my experience, it's the folks who don't believe that Jesus dies spiritually are the ones who tend to get really bent out of shape at the doctrine.
    This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity (futility) of their mind, having the understanding darkened...
    (Ephesians 4:17-18)

    Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly...
    (Psalm 1)

  4. #24
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    I believe Jesus suffered spiritually rather than died spiritually. Dying spiritually implies to me becoming a sinner with a perverted heart in terms of its inclincations and motivations.

    Acts 2:24 whom God raised up, having loosed the pains of death, because it was not possible that He should be held by it

    The verse is a reference to one of the psalms :

    Psalm 18:4 The pangs of death surrounded me,
    And the floods of ungodliness made me afraid.
    5 The sorrows of Sheol surrounded me;
    The snares of death confronted me.

    There clearly was more going on than Jesus merely being physically dead, there was something trying to hold him in death, something that would have succeeded with holding you and me.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by LionHeart View Post
    If I had time I would. But they are out of context to defend the Kenyonism of Jesus died spiritually. A text taken out of context can be use as a pretext. This teaching is found nowhere in Christianity except WOF ! It is false doctrine. Luther did not believe this at all either....
    No.

    Defend your position.

    Until you can show me that they are "out-of-context" all I have is your opinion.

    Prove it.


    Psalm 2:7
    I will declare the decree: the LORD hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee.

    Acts 13:33
    God hath fulfilled the same unto us their children, in that he hath raised up Jesus again; as it is also written in the second psalm, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee.

    Hebrews 1:4-6
    (4) Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.
    (5) For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?
    (6) And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.

    Hebrews 5:4-5
    (4) And no man taketh this honour unto himself, but he that is called of God, as was Aaron.
    (5) So also Christ glorified not himself to be made an high priest; but he that said unto him, Thou art my Son, to day have I begotten thee.
    This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity (futility) of their mind, having the understanding darkened...
    (Ephesians 4:17-18)

    Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly...
    (Psalm 1)

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by LionHeart View Post
    Verses that talk about where Jesus was between His death and resurrection

    Luke 23:43, And He said to him, “Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise.”
    Acts 2:27, "Because You will not abandon my soul to Hades, nor allow Your Holy One to undergo decay."
    Acts 2:31, "he looked ahead and spoke of the resurrection of the Christ, that He was neither abandoned to Hades, nor did His flesh suffer decay."
    Acts 13:35, "Therefore He also says in another Psalm, ‘You will not allow Your Holy One to undergo decay.’"
    1 Pet. 3:19, "in which also He went and made proclamation to the spirits now in prison."

    None of these verses say that Jesus went to Hell and suffered (See What are the verses that mention hell in the New Testament?). None. So, how can people such as Joyce Meyer, Kenneth Copeland, Fred Price, Charles Caps, etc., say Jesus suffered in Hell and paid our price there? They can't because it doesn't say anything of the sort. For anyone to say that Christ actually suffered in Hell at the hands of the devil by taking our place, the person has read into the text things that are simply not there. It is not proper to interpret Scripture in any manner that is not faithful to the text. We see from the verses listed above that Jesus was going to Paradise, His body did not undergo decay and that He made proclamation to the spirits now in prison. It does not say in any of the verses that He suffered in Hell. It just isn't there.
    Acts 2:24 whom God raised up, having loosed the pains of death, because it was not possible that He should be held by it.

    Acts 2:31, "he looked ahead and spoke of the resurrection of the Christ, that He was neither abandoned to Hades, nor did His flesh suffer decay."

    It seems reasonable to me to conclude that since death could not hold him in Hades but had to let go of him therefore he wasn't abandoned to Hades. And this happened before his flesh had decayed entirely since he resurrected within three days.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by LionHeart View Post
    I was listening to Kenneth Hagin Sr. in 1979 on the radio. I heard this teaching for the first time in my life.My spirit man went flat line as he was teaching On Jesus went to hell. I looked at the radio and said to myself, "this has something to do with this teaching on that radio !" The Holy Spirit witness was speaking clearly to me as a baby Christian that I could listen to this man but reject this teaching. I had not even read the New Testament through yet. I learned to follow this inner witness from my early days. In this case it help me not throw out the baby with the bath water. I continued to listen to Hagin for many years after this and even attended a WOF church for many years. But that powerful inner witness told me clearly that this was error I was hearing and I had not even had enough scriptural knowledge to form an opinion. When I later heard this taught in WOF there was always an anger at those that would disagree with them and this teaching. I think the Holy Spirit is trying to get to them with the inner witness and they are overriding Him therefore the anger.
    Hagin probably went too far in his renditions in that sermon. Copeland has gone even further at times. Kind of like Hyper-JDS. There is still a baby to be salvaged from the bath water, as GodismyJudge points out.

  8. #28
    Senior Member Nikos's Avatar
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    I'm with Lionheart on this one. This is an idea that is not in the Bible. It is quite a stretch of scripture.

  9. #29
    In I Corinthians 15:3,4, Paul gives us what he clearly feels is the essence of the Gospel saying, “. . . that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures . . . . ” No mention is made of the Lord’s alleged descent and torment in hell, such teaching is without biblical warrant. 1) The scriptures do not teach that Jesus suffered a “spiritual death” on the cross that severed Him from union with God resulting in His becoming a mere mortal man.
    2) The scriptures do not teach that Jesus descended into hell to there suffer at the hands of Satan for three days and nights.
    3) The scriptures do not teach that Jesus was, subsequent to His death on the cross, born again, and is now an exalted, resurrected man.
    In discussing his ministry, the Apostle Paul wrote the Corinthians that he “determined to know nothing . . . except Jesus Christ, and Him crucified” (I Corinthians 2:2). He made it abundantly clear that the heart of the Gospel was the truth about Christ “and Him crucified” (I Corinthians 1:23; 15:3,4; Galatians 6:14; I Timothy 1:15).

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  11. #30
    Actually it is scary because the Jehovah witnesses quote the same scriptures about Jesus being begotten to prove an entire other heretical teaching. Again, the teaching arose from Kenyon stringing together some scriptures of of context to prove his errors. It is not found anywhere in any branch of Christianity !This is why very Biblical scholars like Pentecostal pastor J.R. Goodwin rejected Hagin's repeating of Kenyon's errors. He knew they were not sound Biblical doctrine.

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