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Thread: Jesus born again?

  1. #1
    Senior Member Smitty's Avatar
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    Jesus born again?

    Over in 1 Timothy 3:16 says Jesus was justified(KJV) or "...vindicated in Spirit." Notice Cap S in Spirit here.
    1 Peter 3:18 says Jesus being "...put to death in the flesh, but quickened(KJV) or made "alive in the spirit." Notice small s in spirit here.
    Bill Johnson says in this 1 min clip that Jesus was "born again."
    What do you say? I seriously can't come to a concrete answer to this question. Any theologians out there who can absolutely say this is sound doctrine that Jesus was born again? Do the two verses above offer any clues that Jesus was born again before or after His His resurrection?
    Are there any other scriptural proofs or clues that point to Jesus actually being born again?


    http://www.cerm.info/audio_files/bj_jesus_bg.mp3
    If you put God First, you have Him at Last.

  2. #2
    This was a pretty in-depth discussion we had...

    This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity (futility) of their mind, having the understanding darkened...
    (Ephesians 4:17-18)

    Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly...
    (Psalm 1)

  3. #3
    Senior Member Cardinal TT's Avatar
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    I don't believe Jesus was Born Again because that would mean his spirit was sinful and fallen and he needed salvation
    Jesus as a supposedly sinful man is telling the Father to forgive all his killers as well as offering the thief on the cross eternal salvation - that doesn't make sense

    The Father put all of our sins on Jesus and he became sinful in a vicarious way but his spirit never became defiled or sinful

    The scripture says he was the First born from the dead but that is referring to his resurrection

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    Administrator fuego's Avatar
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    I don't have any problem with the teaching because I understand it. Meaning I understand what is being taught as the foundation and then understand how Jesus being 'born again' comes out of that foundation. He was/is the 'first born from the dead' (as well as the scriptures Bill refers to in the recording). Well that's not talking about him being born in the earth as a child, but being born after being 'dead' (which can't be talking about being just physically dead because no person raised from the being physically dead in the Bible is referred to as being 'born again') but is referring to Jesus being made sin for us, taking on our spiritual death, and then when He was raised He was born from death to life just like we were.

    If Jesus was the 'first born from the dead' that means you and I are the second born, third born, one-millionth born, etc. And it is talking about us being born again from being spiritually dead (separated from God, not cessation of life which never happens to anyone, saint or sinner). That being the case, Jesus was the first born from being spiritually dead, since we are a part of that line too.

    There's a real emotional knee-jerk reaction to this teaching which I don't get. As well as the teaching that Jesus actually suffered in hell which I also agree with.

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    Administrator fuego's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal TT View Post
    I don't believe Jesus was Born Again because that would mean his spirit was sinful and fallen and he needed salvation
    Jesus as a supposedly sinful man is telling the Father to forgive all his killers as well as offering the thief on the cross eternal salvation - that doesn't make sense

    The Father put all of our sins on Jesus and he became sinful in a vicarious way but his spirit never became defiled or sinful

    The scripture says he was the First born from the dead but that is referring to his resurrection
    Read my post above. Couldn't be referring to His physical resurrection due to what I said above. That's very plain.

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    Senior Member Cardinal TT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fuego View Post
    There's a real emotional knee-jerk reaction to this teaching which I don't get. As well as the teaching that Jesus actually suffered in hell which I also agree with.
    No emotional knee jerk reaction but a proper exegesis of the Greek words


    The Greek words are very clear and specific
    When Jesus used born again it was 2 different Greek words compared to the Greek word of first born(begotten)

    Born again refers to our spirit - First Born refers to the physical

    First born in scripture is linked to the physical - the Greek uses it for Jesus' natural birth
    Matt 1:25 - and did not know her till she had brought forth her firstborn Son. And he called His name JESUS.

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    Senior Member Cardinal TT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fuego View Post
    Read my post above. Couldn't be referring to His physical resurrection due to what I said above. That's very plain.
    You are mixing up the Greek words and confusing the point - It's only plain if you change the Greek to say what it doesn't

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    Senior Member Cardinal TT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Smitty View Post
    Over in 1 Timothy 3:16 says Jesus was justified(KJV) or "...vindicated in Spirit." Notice Cap S in Spirit here.
    1 Peter 3:18 says Jesus being "...put to death in the flesh, but quickened(KJV) or made "alive in the spirit." Notice small s in spirit here.
    Bill Johnson says in this 1 min clip that Jesus was "born again."

    Because Bill Johnson has a world wide ministry many believers just assume whatever he says is always accurate.
    Having signs and wonder or prophetic gifts doesn't make one scripturally correct.



    What do you say? I seriously can't come to a concrete answer to this question. Any theologians out there who can absolutely say this is sound doctrine that Jesus was born again? Do the two verses above offer any clues that Jesus was born again before or after His His resurrection?


    Are there any other scriptural proofs or clues that point to Jesus actually being born again?

    Absolutely ZERO proofs that Jesus' spirit became dead, sinful and fallen. Alot of spinning scripture to try to make that out


    http://www.cerm.info/audio_files/bj_jesus_bg.mp3
    .

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  15. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by GodismyJudge View Post
    This was a pretty in-depth discussion we had...

    And then, as now, as you can tell, Cardinal TT strongly disagrees with the premise...














    .
    This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity (futility) of their mind, having the understanding darkened...
    (Ephesians 4:17-18)

    Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly...
    (Psalm 1)

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    Senior Member Cardinal TT's Avatar
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    Jesus took all our sins but his spirit remained without spot (Gk -faultless). It had to remain without spot for God to accept his bodily offering

    Heb 9:14 - how much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered Himself without spot to God, cleanse your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?

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