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Thread: Discipleship

  1. #1
    Senior Member Smitty's Avatar
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    Discipleship

    Many new converts lack discipleship because they were not told that they have to accept Jesus lordship in their lives. His lordship over their lives will always produce some sacrifices. Just as Jesus carried His cross to the place of crucifixion, each new convert must be willing to take up his/her own cross and be prepared to die to the desires of his fallen sinful nature, and to the past desires of the sinful pleasures of this world. Even if the Christian's discipleship does not lead to a physical death (martyrdom), it will involve a certain amount of hardship, suffering, and persecution. People who rattle off a sinner's prayer, must be properly mentored, (discipled) and told from the get go what it will cost them to be Jesus' disciples. They must be prepared to live a lifetime commitment to Jesus which involves being a continual learner and doer of God's word. To put their responsibilities to Christ before all other responsibilities, and to be wholehearted in their devotion and worship to the Lord Jesus Christ. There is no place for those who make a start and then give up.

    With that said, let me add a few more thoughts here. Pentecostalism came out of the holiness movement of a century and a half ago, and was known for it's holiness "do's and don'ts" (some may shout legalism) but the fact remains, you will rarely hear a sermon on holiness these days. Much of the modern church's emphasis is on conversions and church growth rather than on discipleship. Much of the western mega church's ambition is all about converts and getting people to say a sinners prayer. I can teach a parrot to recite the sinners prayer. That doesn't mean the parrot is a Christian.

    Someone may be hollering right about now, "What's your point Smitty?" We've moved away from discipleship, and as a result, we no longer see people thinking and behaving the right way (godly living). That leads to the real question. How are new converts living six months, a year or two after they recited the sinners prayer? What's their current behavior? Are they producing fruit worthy of repentance?

    Another definition of discipleship could mean teaching and modeling how to live a life set apart from the secular, godless culture. That set-apart life is what we used to call "holiness." "Be holy, for I am holy," the Bible says in 1 Peter 1:16. But I've noticed there is a famine in the land as far as teaching on holiness is concerned (not to be confused with legalism). And not only is there very few teaching on holiness, but we largely don't have the fear of God anymore either. There is no remorse for personal sins committed, and there is no sense of having to account to God for our behavior and our thoughts which we know are contrary to Scripture. The outcome is believers who may have prayed a sinner's prayer months or years earlier are not confronting wrong behavior (sinful), saying this is wrong and I need to change according to God's word. It's no wonder that much of the western church have now become a user-friendly kind of church. We don't want you feeling bad about things. We don't want to preach a radical message from God's word that will radically change your life.

    Over in the gospel of John, chapter six, Jesus said some things that offended the crowds. Many left Him. His disciples said to Him, 'This is a hard teaching; who can bear it?' He looked at them and said, 'Are you guys leaving Me too?' They answered, 'No, we'll stay with you. You've got the bread of life.' But man, this is hard stuff! I don't know about you, but I don't know of any church in this country that is being accused of teaching hard stuff and driving people away, with only a few true disciples remaining to be taught more." Let me close this post out by saying as the seeker friendly church culture explodes, the few pastors and churches that still do put emphasis on genuine godly discipleship, and teach on holiness, the fear of God, and living right according to God's word, will reap the benefits of seeing mature disciples of our Lord Jesus Christ go out and change the culture of compromise within much of the church, and the godless society in which we live in today.

    (Any and all comments are encouraged to add to this thread).
    If you put God First, you have Him at Last.

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  3. #2
    Be encouraged there is yet a remnant of those that have a burden and vision for making disciples. These also preach that holiness is necessary if we are making disciples and producing converts. We preach as Paul did, "come out from them and be holy". We still believe drinking alcohol is not conducive to having a strong witness for Christ, as is cussing (unholy speech). We are to set examples for the young, impressionable ones that forsaking the world and it's lustful desires cultivates a God honoring life and will build character that will withstand the storms in life that are to come.

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  5. #3
    Well said, Brothers!

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  7. #4
    Senior Member Smitty's Avatar
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    I realize that there are quit a few seasoned Christians here at Living Faith Forum who have been saved for many, many years.
    I too have been around "the Lord's table" if you will, for a long time (more than half my life).
    I find it necessary though to "refresh" my spiritual thinking with practical "fundamentals of the faith" once in awhile.
    I have used these video's for several years to do just that.
    So, I share them with you, if you think you may need a spiritual "tune up" in an area of your discipleship walk with the Lord.
    Fundamentals of the Faith – WVBS Online Video
    If you put God First, you have Him at Last.

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    Senior Member Ezekiel 33's Avatar
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    Smitty this is why I have such a deep appreciation of TLR and the ministry they do. They are about making disciples of Jesus.

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    Administrator fuego's Avatar
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    We were commanded to make disciples, not converts. Of course you have to get them converted to disciple them, but most stop at the conversion.

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  13. #7
    Senior Member Ezekiel 33's Avatar
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    A few years back I ran a program that I called "Extreme Discipleship Training" in the small church I was pastoring. It was not well accepted by most. I actually had people come up (if they would) and present the gospel using cups & cookies after watching the video from TLR. Way out of most people's comfort zone, but exactly what Jesus commanded us to do.

    When someone sets in a "church" for several years and can say that they have never led someone to Jesus there is a problem. This tells me that the 5-fold is not doing what Paul says in Ephesians 4-Equipping the saints for the work of the ministry.

  14. #8
    Senior Member Smitty's Avatar
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    If anyone is interested in Keith Moore's 30 minute faith school segments on YouTube, here is the link.
    I have begun going through these classes for a couple of weeks now. These classes are very good teaching's on faith.
    Monday - Why Faith? - YouTube
    If you put God First, you have Him at Last.

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  16. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Ezekiel 33 View Post
    A few years back I ran a program that I called "Extreme Discipleship Training" in the small church I was pastoring. It was not well accepted by most. I actually had people come up (if they would) and present the gospel using cups & cookies after watching the video from TLR. Way out of most people's comfort zone, but exactly what Jesus commanded us to do.

    When someone sets in a "church" for several years and can say that they have never led someone to Jesus there is a problem. This tells me that the 5-fold is not doing what Paul says in Ephesians 4-Equipping the saints for the work of the ministry.
    The need is great.

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  18. #10
    When Paul said that we need to confess Jesus as Lord he meant that we acknowledge His deity and supremacy. It doesn't mean that "If He's not Lord of all then He's not Lord AT all." This is where many people get off into Lordship Salvation which is borderline works based salvation. When you get away from grace you're getting away from the gospel.

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