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Thread: My Foundational Assumptions and Questions for Theological Debate and Christian Apologetics

  1. #11
    Frozen Chosen A.J.'s Avatar
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    Pentecostal trolls ...

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  3. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Berserk View Post
    Fascinating! All I did in my OP was outline methodological assumptions for topics to follow and Fundamentalist Pentecostal trolls launch ad hominem attacks before they even hear what I have to say! That is truly low-grade spirituality, which anti-intellectual Pentecostalism has taught me to expect. In my experience, Pentecostals are like a myopic ideological Ghetto that is threatened by outsiders and uses disdain for academics to avoid the hard work of critical thinking to evade the need to see what they can actually learn spiritually from outsiders. As Gordon Edmunds, a wise older saint in the Pentecostal church of my youth once memorably told me, "You don't have to be stupid to be a Christian, but sometimes I think it sure helps!" Despite this, I will linger a little longer until I actually share some biblical insights. And I do love this caricature of the Pentecostal ethos that I once heard in a sermon and never forgot:

    "I like my religion the way I like my tea--hot. Because it's easier to cool a hot coal than warm up a corpse and I'd rather be a fool on fire than a scholar on ice. Amen? Honestly, brethren, I drive by some of dem liberal churches and I take my hat off out of respect for the dead!"
    Do you jump to conclusions by a degree of training or do you come by it naturally?

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  5. #13
    So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed. John's Avatar
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    Let's try to keep it collegial.




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  7. #14
    Berserk, it might help you to know that this is primarily a place of fellowship. We pray for and support one another and, yes, we also contend for our understanding of Scripture. It can get heated at times, but still it's a place for fellowship. If you're looking for a forum that's primarily contentious, you might look elsewhere. In short, just take some time to get to know us and us to know you. You will find the welcome mat out here if fellowship is what you're looking for.

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    Ezekiel 33 (12-19-2019), FireBrand (12-18-2019), John (12-18-2019)

  9. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by John View Post
    Let's try to keep it collegial.



    I'll behave.

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  11. #16
    Senior Member Cardinal TT's Avatar
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    As a Cardinal I certainly endorse the higher critical academic mindset but know I must humble myself and relate to the lower christian classes like this forum.

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    Ezekiel 33 (12-19-2019)

  13. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Bookman View Post
    Berserk, it might help you to know that this is primarily a place of fellowship. We pray for and support one another and, yes, we also contend for our understanding of Scripture. It can get heated at times, but still it's a place for fellowship. If you're looking for a forum that's primarily contentious, you might look elsewhere. In short, just take some time to get to know us and us to know you. You will find the welcome mat out here if fellowship is what you're looking for.
    And it might help you to be reminded that I specified in the OP that I wanted to substantially finish my personal testimony BEFORE developing the present thread. Why? Obviously because I wanted members to get to know me personally before I expressed views (sometimes controversial) that readers might find spiritually helpful. I thought, wrongly, that conversation and theological discussion might be more warm and personal if readers knew my spiritual priorities and life experiences. My Harvard doctoral thesis focused on the gift of prophecy, how it was understood in ancient Judaism, and the early church of the first 3 centuries, and who could exorcise this gift. My professors agreed that my 455 thesis broke new ground, and recommended it for publication. I thought you might be interested in the relevance of this to modern Pentecostal exercise of the gift of prophecy in corporate worship. But the thesis is so technical and detailed that I thought that if I liked the people on this site I would seek ways to simplify it for thread discussion.

    You claim, "we pray for and support one another." Well, I'm a member of a weekly Monday prayer group of 5 that has seen marvelous healings and other answers to prayer over the years and I intended to share our experiences and insights as well as our problems. I also weekly visit a mentally ill but deeply spiritual bipolar schizophrenic on dialysis, who is desperate to rekindle his faith, which has been destroyed by his perception that God just doesn't care about his suffering. A lot of harm has been done by wannabe Pentecostal exorcists who confuse mental illness with demonic possession and do more harm than good by trying an failing to exorcise the mentally ill. I wanted to discuss my friends' and family's experiences with exorcism and lessons learned on how to minister to the mentally ill. But I can't pray with people I dislike. So my stay here will not be long.

  14. #18
    Senior Member Cardinal TT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berserk View Post
    So my stay here will not be long.
    You need to try to stay a bit longer and let people get to know you. Since you are academically trained your comments may come across condescending not that you mean it that way but most here have gotten use to each other over the years and understand their comments even when they disagree.
    People need time to relate to your history, education, experience and the way you communicate

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  16. #19
    So my stay here will not be long.
    That would be a loss for us and, I believe, for you. The problem is we've had people in the past who wanted to be here primarily to teach us something they know, but suppose we don't. Or to set us straight on some pet doctrine. If that's not your intent I do hope you'll stay and be a part of us. If not, I hope you find the kind of forum you're looking for.

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  18. #20
    Senior Member Ezekiel 33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berserk View Post
    I look forward to your responses when I develop this thread after I finish my testimony. I have an MDiv from Princeton and a doctorate from Harvard in New Testament, Judaism, and Greco-Roman background and am an academically published author on theological issues. I was a Theology professor for 12 years and was a Teaching Fellow at Harvard in undergrad Classics and Graduate New Testament. I have sent a grad student to the exciting archaeological dig at Bethsaida and his discoveries have led to him being featured on a Nova science program. Apparently, you are not a scholar. Otherwise, you would recognize OP as fairly standard academic methodology. I make no apologies for it.
    I'm just an ignorant fisherman.



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