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Thread: The God of Conservative/Evangelicals is a hypocrite

  1. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel View Post
    In that case there is no point in discussing it.

    You are right but its growing in certain circles so believers need to know how to defend the true doctrines when confronted by lies

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  3. #12
    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal TT View Post
    You are right but its growing in certain circles so believers need to know how to defend the true doctrines when confronted by lies
    What I said resolves the hypocrisy question, at any rate. It would be an un-christian thing to do to forgive a murderer to the point where one doesn't bother to involve a court of law in having him sentenced. A perversion of justice, in fact.

  4. #13
    Senior Member Ezekiel 33's Avatar
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    "The wages of sin is death" is a law that goes all the way back to the creation. It cannot be revoked.

    And yet another law says that "Without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sins".

    And then the Lord, out of His deep love for His creation sent His only begotten Son to shed His precious Holy Blood for the sins of the whole world.

    God is so loving that He provided an unblemished sacrifice, the Lion of the tribe of Judah to pay a debt He did not owe.

    Jesus said that we are to love our enemies.
    How could He say such a thing?

    BECAUSE HE DID!


    We were at enmity with God (His enemies) because of sins we committed by our own free will, and He loved us so much that He paid for our crimes!!!

    But He also did much more, in that He set us free from sin! He gave us a new nature.
    For those who repent and put their faith in Jesus Christ there is an exchange of natures. It was natural for us to sin. We receive a brand new nature, the nature of Christ Jesus.
    Now we have to willfully go against that nature in order to sin.

    This is called being "Born again". It is a supernatural experience. Without it a person cannot see the kingdom of Heaven.

    Each person has sinned and condemned themselves to Hell. God didn't condemn them.

    Each person has the opportunity to ACCEPT forgiveness of and freedom from sin and it's consequence-Death/eternal torment in the lake of fire.

    People will go to spend eternity in Hell. Not because God is unloving, but because they refuse to accept His love.

    I guess that makes them the unloving ones?


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  6. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal TT View Post
    Something I read recently and is being promoted by some believers who reject hell
    Basically they say...according to mainstream Christianity God expects us to forgive but why doesn't he forgive those who don't believe in him

    They then accuse the mainstream/conservative/evangelicals of making up a God that contradicts himself therefore is a hypocrite

    Since God is love and not a hypocrite he must then totally forgive everyone regardless of what they believe.

    Hence their version of God is compatible with his character and the mainstream version is false.

    I hope I've explained that clearly


    How would you respond to their argument?
    Some who ask such questions are insincere and only want an excuse to reject Christ and remain in sin. I never waste my time with them [anymore]

    But there are others who are sincere and are really looking for an answer. Here is how I deal with them.

    God never intended man to sin and never created hell/lake of fire for man. None of it was in His plan. When man did sin he made a choice to reject God and separate himself from God. When his body dies then his spirit will make that choice permanent and eternal - separation from God is completely the choice of each individual.

    Therefore it is not a matter of forgiveness on God's part. Immediately after man sinned God provided a provision for the way back to Himself. Man had the choice to accept or reject that provision. That provision today culminates in Jesus Christ. The Almighty God begs and pleads with men to be reconciled to Him. Men choose to stay separated from God and then make excuses as to why they do it, such as the idea that He should just forgive me even while I am living in open rebellion to Him. The true fact is, He not only ready to forgive but He is deeply in love with the person. But He MUST honor the person's choice. If a person wants to be separated from God then He will not force a reconciliation as badly as He wants the person to come to Him (and He wants them badly. Jesus cries profusely over those in hell).

    Those people do NOT want forgiveness. They want a life of sin with NO CONSEQUENCES (temporal or eternal). But choices have consequences both now and in eternity and God MUST honor that choice.
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  8. #15
    The dangerous part is that believers including Pentecostals who speak in tongues are now accepting this and telling others it is scriptural truth

    God is so loving that he automatically forgave everyone because of what Jesus did - no need to repent, no need to accept Jesus, everyone is now a child of God
    God doesn't judge anyone - some even go further and say Jesus didn't even need to die and shed his blood

    The impression I get is that many have been majorly hurt by fellow believers, tv preachers, their pastors or churches and in their hurt get offended and become open to deception

    They say the church is harsh, legalistic, controlling and many leaders are like the pharisees of Jesus' day
    We all know there is some truth to many of these complaints but satan has caused their offense to be magnified and they embrace a false image of God

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  10. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal TT View Post
    They call any Christian who believes that as promoting a monster God
    That's ok. They are headed in that very direction.

    When you are Universalist you dont have to repent of unrighteous living.

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  12. #17
    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FireBrand View Post
    That’s ok. They are headed in that very direction.

    When you are Universalist you dont have to repent of unrighteous living.
    The same can be the case if one believes in certain versions of Calvinism or osas.

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  14. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel View Post
    The same can be the case if one believes in certain versions of Calvinism or osas.
    Right. I remember discussing this. Sadly, the reformed folk wont get it.

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  16. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal TT View Post
    Something I read recently and is being promoted by some believers who reject hell
    Basically they say...according to mainstream Christianity God expects us to forgive but why doesn't he forgive those who don't believe in him

    They then accuse the mainstream/conservative/evangelicals of making up a God that contradicts himself therefore is a hypocrite

    Since God is love and not a hypocrite he must then totally forgive everyone regardless of what they believe.

    Hence their version of God is compatible with his character and the mainstream version is false.

    I hope I've explained that clearly


    How would you respond to their argument?
    I would question if they are genuine believers who are saying this. It sounds more like universalism to be honest. They fail to understand the difference between God's forgiveness and our experience and appropriation of that forgiveness.

    In any relationship forgiveness is appropriated through repentance. If someone hurts you and you have forgiven them, but they never come to you seeking your forgiveness, it is their loss. The forgiveness is there, it is available, but they will not come to you and ask for forgiveness, will not repent for how they hurt you, will not seek any kind of reconciliation. They cannot come back and blame you for the continued rift in the relationship.

    God's forgiveness is here by virtue of Jesus' sacrifice on the cross. It is available for asking. So, these people who think that God should just forgive someone, perhaps an Atheist, that persists in is unbelief don't understand how forgiveness works.

    So there is no hypocrisy on God's part. It's just their false theology that is problematic.

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  18. #20
    Senior Member Ezekiel 33's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal TT View Post
    The dangerous part is that believers including Pentecostals who speak in tongues are now accepting this and telling others it is scriptural truth

    God is so loving that he automatically forgave everyone because of what Jesus did - no need to repent, no need to accept Jesus, everyone is now a child of God
    God doesn't judge anyone - some even go further and say Jesus didn't even need to die and shed his blood

    The impression I get is that many have been majorly hurt by fellow believers, tv preachers, their pastors or churches and in their hurt get offended and become open to deception

    They say the church is harsh, legalistic, controlling and many leaders are like the pharisees of Jesus' day
    We all know there is some truth to many of these complaints but satan has caused their offense to be magnified and they embrace a false image of God
    Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons,

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