Results 1 to 7 of 7

Thread: Who is on whose side ?

  1. #1
    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Oslo, Norway
    Posts
    14,487
    Thanked: 5793

    Who is on whose side ?

    Mat 12:30 He who is not with Me is against Me, and he who does not gather with Me scatters abroad.

    Mark 9:38 Now John answered Him, saying, "Teacher, we saw someone who does not follow us casting out demons in Your name, and we forbade him because he does not follow us."
    39 But Jesus said, "Do not forbid him, for no one who works a miracle in My name can soon afterward speak evil of Me.
    40 For he who is not against us is on our side.

    How do you reconcile the two ? They seem rather contradictory.

  2. #2
    Administrator fuego's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Posts
    16,274
    Thanked: 14133
    Blog Entries
    1
    Not sure how it contradicts. Could you elaborate?

    But let's say they are contradictory. You have to look at the context of both statements. There first was in direct relation to the Pharisees and saying Jesus had a devil and blaspheming the Holy Spirit.

    The second is about someone who wasn't a part of their group, but he was casting out demons in Jesus name. Not quite the same circumstances.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Oslo, Norway
    Posts
    14,487
    Thanked: 5793
    The first verse suggests that to not be against Jesus one has to be with him. Which is what the second person wasn't. Or was he trying to say that that person was in fact with them ?

    The setting is a bit different to ours though since noone was born again, the world is simpler by now.

  4. #4
    Super Moderator Quest's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Ashville, Alabama
    Posts
    5,920
    Thanked: 3402
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel View Post
    Mat 12:30 He who is not with Me is against Me, and he who does not gather with Me scatters abroad.

    Mark 9:38 Now John answered Him, saying, “Teacher, we saw someone who does not follow us casting out demons in Your name, and we forbade him because he does not follow us.”
    39 But Jesus said, “Do not forbid him, for no one who works a miracle in My name can soon afterward speak evil of Me.
    40 For he who is not against us is on our side.

    How do you reconcile the two ? They seem rather contradictory.
    "...IN MY NAME..."

    Based on the whole of scripture the question was about 'physical following', not belief and faith. Jesus noted the belief and faith of acting in His name.

  5. #5
    Super Moderator Quest's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Ashville, Alabama
    Posts
    5,920
    Thanked: 3402
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel View Post
    The first verse suggests that to not be against Jesus one has to be with him. Which is what the second person wasn't. Or was he trying to say that that person was in fact with them ?

    The setting is a bit different to ours though since noone was born again, the world is simpler by now.
    I have not done an indepth word study but reconciling these requires seeing a difference in physical following and actual belief and faith. The first verse is addressing AGREEMENT of belief and faith...the second questioned the authority of casting out demons by others than themselves as His close relationship...

    It must also be noted that we do not yet have the New birth in place....

  6. #6
    I think that throughout Scripture there were those who "followed" God and did righteous (or did evil) in the sight of the Lord (e.g., Kings), kind of a 'lifestyle descriptor."

    For example, Nicodemus was evidently one who knew Jesus was someone from God and was "for Jesus" although he wasn't "with Jesus." He was moving toward receiving what Jesus had to offer, where others, like the Pharisees, were against Jesus. I don't think we need to be sidetracked overall by if the person was "born again" (David wasn't, but God considered him a man after God's own heart - and that's the model that is helpful here).

    The disciples probably felt that since they had a proximity to Jesus, that they were, in a sense, primary, and others who were trying to follow Jesus with "less supervision" were considered to be "secondary" - not on the "core team", and not under their supervision - hence, they had a little uppitty-ness.

    If they were operating in maturity, they would have offered a helping hand to the other "ministers", like Apollos was gently corrected when he was operating with zeal and fervor for Christ (and just needed some more accurate guidance).

  7. #7
    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Oslo, Norway
    Posts
    14,487
    Thanked: 5793
    Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan david View Post
    I think that throughout Scripture there were those who "followed" God and did righteous (or did evil) in the sight of the Lord (e.g., Kings), kind of a 'lifestyle descriptor."

    For example, Nicodemus was evidently one who knew Jesus was someone from God and was "for Jesus" although he wasn't "with Jesus." He was moving toward receiving what Jesus had to offer, where others, like the Pharisees, were against Jesus. I don't think we need to be sidetracked overall by if the person was "born again" (David wasn't, but God considered him a man after God's own heart - and that's the model that is helpful here).

    The disciples probably felt that since they had a proximity to Jesus, that they were, in a sense, primary, and others who were trying to follow Jesus with "less supervision" were considered to be "secondary" - not on the "core team", and not under their supervision - hence, they had a little uppitty-ness.

    If they were operating in maturity, they would have offered a helping hand to the other "ministers", like Apollos was gently corrected when he was operating with zeal and fervor for Christ (and just needed some more accurate guidance).
    The apostles who had been commissioned 2 chapters before in Mat 10 seemed to think that it was a organization thing and the guy who cast out demons wasn't part of that. But he was "with" Jesus just like Nicodemus was in the sense that Mat 12:30 speaks of.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Stop worrying about expensive repair bills with an extended service plan for your Acura. Many vehicle repairs can cost thousands of dollars in unexpected expense, now may be the time to consider an extended service plan for your vehicle.