My Meeting With Pastor Joseph Prince - Michael Brown

**Valiant Woman** · 01-28-2017, 07:00 AM

Originally Posted by Cardinal TT

Ok thanks ...you are right
I got mixed up and meant to quote the part where he says all future sins are forgiven

I wonder what scripture is used to support that our future sins are forgiven? I should think that we must first confess and repent of our sin, according to 1 John 1:9.

**Valiant Woman** · 01-28-2017, 07:03 AM

Originally Posted by fuego

Dr Brown would come under attack for meeting with a guy many believe is a 'hyper-grace heretic' and Prince come under attack for meeting with something that preaches heavily against 'hyper-grace'.

No wonder the Bible calls us "a peculiar people." That's one of the dumbest things I've ever heard. I applaud their meeting, and it's totally biblical.

**Colonel** · 01-28-2017, 02:25 PM

The OP talks about cultural differences and in his own culture Joseph Prince makes more sense. His background is one where every imperfection was a sin and had to be repented of, basically all day long and people were always feeling at least slightly condemned. This is mainly what he has in mind when he talks about sins that need not be asked forgiveness for, not even in the relational sense. According to his book "Destined to reign" he was liberated when he understood that grace simply covers our imperfections which includes things we could have done better, and others have been liberated by the same message too. I suppose we should talk to Jesus in the process of being sanctified away from our lacks and imperfections but that is different to asking for forgiveness for every such thing, which is what some do.

**GodismyJudge** · 01-28-2017, 02:34 PM

Originally Posted by Colonel

The OP talks about cultural differences and in his own culture Joseph Prince makes more sense. His background is one where every imperfection was a sin and had to be repented of, basically all day long and people were always feeling at least slightly condemned. This is mainly what he has in mind when he talks about sins that need not be asked forgiveness for, not even in the relational sense. According to his book "Destined to reign" he was liberated when he understood that grace simply covers our imperfections which includes things we could have done better, and others have been liberated by the same message too. I suppose we should talk to Jesus in the process of being sanctified away from our lacks and imperfections but that is different to asking for forgiveness for every such thing, which is what some do.

Your post reminded me of a quote by Smith Wigglesworth that I came across recently...

"There is a great destructive force that comes upon us when we start comparing ourselves in the flesh with what we could be spiritually. We should never compare what we are with what we could be, because we will always be down on ourselves when we do this. Just look to Jesus and what He is. As long as we look to Jesus we will go toward Him. When we look at our inferiority we will go toward it."

- Smith Wigglesworth

**Colonel** · 01-28-2017, 02:40 PM

Originally Posted by Valiant Woman

I wonder what scripture is used to support that our future sins are forgiven? I should think that we must first confess and repent of our sin, according to 1 John 1:9.

Sin grieves the Holy Spirit and he continues to grieve until we repent and even if it was a one time incident that we don't plan to repeat he expects us to ask for forgiveness for what we did. That is asking for forgiveness in a relational sense.

Which is different to asking to be generally forgiven as in reinstituted into the new covenant. Which is what everyone who has abandoned the faith needs to do since they have departed from grace. The question is if grace moves to cover sins committed (except unbelief) before they are repented of (and if so, to what extent). If not at all, meaning that no future sins are covered by grace, then everyone is consequently outside grace from the moment they sin and until the moment they repent, which is always a duration. For that duration the person would consequently end up in hell if they happened to die.

Nope, it does not work that way. Grace covers sin but it does not cover unbelief, the rejection of Christ. Does that mean that people can just live in all kinds of sin and end up in heaven ? Nope, it doesn't. The reason why is that when sin matures, it gives birth to death. It will eventually kill faith, the Holy Spirit will depart and the person will be outside grace.

How much sinning without repenting does it take before that happens ? We don't know until it happens, that is one good reason why we should avoid sin like the plague. To some people stepping into a sin can amount to an implicit rejection of the faith, at least at the heart level. Other people compartmentalize their lives and survive for a duration but there is always a limit to it. Some people are saved by the bell, dying before sin killed their faith. That's luck.

**victoryword** · 01-28-2017, 03:46 PM

Originally Posted by Cardinal TT

Ok thanks ...you are right
I got mixed up and meant to quote the part where he says all future sins are forgiven

Originally Posted by Valiant Woman

I wonder what scripture is used to support that our future sins are forgiven? I should think that we must first confess and repent of our sin, according to 1 John 1:9.

AMEN! One would be hard pressed to find a passage that tells us that sin is forgiven BEFORE it is confessed and forsaken:

He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.*(Prov. 28:13)

Ooops. I quoted an Old Testament passage. My "grace" friends will tell me this is under the Old covenant. My bad.

Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart may be forgiven thee. (Acts 8:22)

Some need to read Revelation 2:20-23 as well. Jesus Himself told Jezebel and her followers to repent in order to receive forgiveness. Hence, my friends that teach that all future sins are already forgiven are sadly mistaken. This one error in doctrine could still lead millions into wrong conclusions and jeopardize their eternity.

**Colonel** · 01-28-2017, 04:05 PM

The future sin of unbelief is certainly not forgiven in advance nor covered by grace. One enters into the new covenant by faith, one departs from the new covenant by unbelief. Turn to unbelief and die the next second and you will find yourself in hell. There is no lag involved before the Holy Spirit departs.

**Colonel** · 01-28-2017, 04:45 PM

Romans 5:1 Jesus Christ,
2 through whom also we have access by faith into this grace in which we stand

That sums it all up.

**Jonathan david** · 01-28-2017, 09:06 PM

I applaud the meeting between Dr. Brown and Ptr. Prince. This is exactly how leaders in the Body of Christ should resolve misunderstandings and differences, through a meaningful and respectful dialogue. Note that some misunderstandings were noted and now they have a more accurate take of each other's position, and that they are substantially in agreement.

Let's be honest here, that there are often subtle and nuanced aspects of doctrine, that one "side" can GET more accurately than the other. Perhaps the wording is better from one angle, and God forbid, BOTH angles have their merit scripturally.

This dialogue has set a good pattern that others should follow: Rather than blasting someone's teachings in your Christian-Criticizer.com page that you think are heresy, give the benefit of the doubt. TALK to them in an open way as a grown adult, not as someone who has to "be right" and think you are God's gift to "right theology."

**GodismyJudge** · 01-28-2017, 09:20 PM

Originally Posted by Jonathan david

I applaud the meeting between Dr. Brown and Ptr. Prince. This is exactly how leaders in the Body of Christ should resolve misunderstandings and differences, through a meaningful and respectful dialogue. Note that some misunderstandings were noted and now they have a more accurate understanding of each other's position, and that they are substantially in agreement.

Let's be honest here, that there are often subtle and nuanced to aspects of doctrine, that one "side" can GET more accurately than the other. Perhaps the wording is better from one angle, and God forbid, BOTH angles have their merit scripturally.

This dialogue has set a good pattern that others should follow: Rather than blasting someone's teachings in your Christian-Criticizer.com page that you think are heresy, give the benefit of the doubt. TALK to them in an open way as a grown adult, not as someone who has to "be right" and think you are God's gift to "right theology."

Kenneth E. Hagin once said that he had heard another minister say that discussing Bible truths is like climbing up a mountain. When you climb up one side you have one view, when you climb up the other side you have a different view, but it's the same mountain.

Thread: My Meeting With Pastor Joseph Prince - Michael Brown

Thread Tools

Search Thread

Display

The Following User Says Thank You to Valiant Woman For This Useful Post:

The Following User Says Thank You to Colonel For This Useful Post:

The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to GodismyJudge For This Useful Post:

The Following User Says Thank You to Colonel For This Useful Post:

The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to victoryword For This Useful Post:

The Following User Says Thank You to Colonel For This Useful Post:

The Following User Says Thank You to Colonel For This Useful Post:

The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Jonathan david For This Useful Post:

The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to GodismyJudge For This Useful Post:

Posting Permissions