Thread: Was Judas a believer?

Judas was a disciple. The depth of what he believed cannot be gleaned from reading scripture, so the best we can do is to guess by his actions. Could you walk alongside Jesus and the 11 for over 3 years and not believe that He was indeed who He said He was?

Originally Posted by krystian

Doing works in His name does not necessarily make one a believer:

Matthew 7
²¹ Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
²² Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
²³ And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.





Believing and being a committed follower are two different things:

James 2:19 ...the devils also believe, and tremble.

Krystian, it always amuses me when someone uses that Scripture in Matthew 7 the way that you did. I usually see cessationists use this passage to question the validity of miracles by faith. You are now using it in relation to questioning my evidence of Judas' discipleship. Yet, it says, "Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?"

Anyone can "say" that they did these works for the Lord but this doesn't mean that they actually did the miracles or if they did do them that they did it by God's power. I am aware of pastors in churches in Nigeria who actually make covenants with Satan to grow their church. They do miracles too. Now on the other hand, we have this passage:

Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father. (John 14:12)

It takes faith to work genuine non-satanic miracles for Christ. Judas at one time, had faith. He may have lost it later but he was a definite disciple of Jesus in the beginning.

Originally Posted by Quest

He was called the son of perdition..

The disciples were GIVEN authority by Jesus...after His death and resurrection we were filled with the same Spirit as Jesus and function as one clean and holy.

Judas was a disciple, but was lost.

Jesus said that He would be betrayed by someone based on prophesy but woe to that man..it would be better had he not been born..if I recall correctly..
So Judas believed but did not place His faith in Jesus and progress to salvation. IMHO

The disciples were given authority by Jesus BEFORE His death and ressurection. See Matthew 10, Luke 9, and Luke 10. Especially note Luke 10:17-20 where Jesus tells all of them that their names are written in Heaven. Judas was not a "son of perdition" but later became one due to his walking away from Christ.

Are you saying that God predestined Judas to be the "son of perdition" from the foundations of the world?

Originally Posted by Colonel

The local context of the verses from matthew 7 seems to be disciples that Jesus sent out with authority to heal the sick etc and who later demand entry into heaven based on that. People werent born again until after the resurrection so the situation was a bit different to now when it is impossible to operate in the anointing without being a born again believer, at least at the time when one was doing so.

It would appear to me that Matthew 7 is speaking about the white throne judgment (from Rev. 20-21). BUt then again, I am not OSAS nor do I have no obligation to hold to a stringent dispensational interpretation of Scripture so I can easily see Jesus words as pertaining to the future white throne judgment.