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Thread: Did God Send Joseph to Egypt?

  1. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Femme* View Post
    It never fails to amuse me when man decides that God is lacking in some way.

    He surely doesn't need me, or anyone else for that, to defend Him.

    God never looks "evil" or 'untrustworthy".
    Your post shows me why I have a strong intense hatred for Calvinism. It is this kind of smug arrogance with its cold uncompassionate heart that keeps me from having any sympathy for it. It twists the Biblical God of love and make Him out to be a tyrannical monster.

    What is even more interesting is the Calvinist need to spread this ideology.
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  2. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Bookman View Post
    I'm not sure I'd word it either way. It's like a man who owns stand of timber and his jealous enemy wants to destroy him, so he cuts down all the beautiful trees, thinking he has thwarted his neighbor by destroying his major asset. But the reality is the man who owns the trees was just about to harvest the timber and sell it for a huge profit. Thus his enemy, though out to destroy him, really only succeeded in accomplishing the will of the tree farmer. If that makes sense.

    In the verses I quoted, this is the key phrase: "which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know:

    Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain..."


    It wasn't just that God turned their evil deed to good. No, instead, in crucifying the Lord they were actually fulfilling the "determinate counsel of God."
    It makes sense, and I agree with you that your analogy does work in the case of Christ's crucifixion and even Joseph's situation. But I am not sure that I would agree with the analogy as it relates to evil in every single case. Here's why:

    • Jer 19:5 They have built also the high places of Baal, to burn their sons with fire for burnt offerings unto Baal, which I commanded not, nor spake it, neither came it into my mind:


    Some sinful things are simply never a part of God's plan.
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    GodismyJudge (01-30-2016)

  4. #13
    Did God Send Joseph to Egypt? (Part 2)

    http://cvbibleteachingcenter.blogspo...pt-part-2.html

    This post tells us how Joseph's words can be understood in the "permissive sense".
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  5. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by victoryword View Post
    It is this kind of smug arrogance
    let me hold up that mirror for you.

  6. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Femme* View Post
    let me hold up that mirror for you.
    All I see in the above reply is someone who is determined to win.

  7. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel View Post
    All I see in the above reply is someone who is determined to win.
    I don't need to "win" anything.. as I said, God doesn't need me to defend Him.

    I know I'm the odd man out here, I'm fine with that.

    What I see is God's CREATION thinking it's ok to make judgments about His actions.

    And I get called arrogant?!?

    That's ludicrous. ANY time man thinks to critique the sovereign of the universe it's time for a reevaluation of what's what.

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    curly sue (01-30-2016)

  9. #17
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    Louis XIV of France "I'm sovereign and I'm also benevolent"

    Subject "Yeah, I heard recently that you walked down the streets of Paris chopping off heads at random with an axe you brought and noone dared to stop you"

    Louis XIV of France "That's not what I use my sovereignty for, like I said, I'm benevolent."

    Subject "What does it matter, I'm your loyal subject whatever you do with your absolute sovereignty. Your illoyal subjects cringe when they hear that story and start thinking about leaving the country but I don't, it doesn't matter to me."

    Louis XIV of France "I suppose they have understood that as Sovereign King, I'm entitled to using my powers for good. Maybe people like you who propagate lies about me in the name of my sovereignty are the ones that should be held as illoyal. Not to my sovereignty but to the uprightness of my character."

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    victoryword (01-31-2016)

  11. #18
    Sometimes I think these quibbles really distract from the common truth both sides share: Walk in faith towards God...in ALL circumstances. That's what Joseph did in the thick of extreme adversity. He came out realizing that what was meant for his harm, was working for good all along--and that was by the design of God. So whether you believe God orchestrated the circumstances that led to the God-ordained outcome or that He simply "recalculated" the trip, based on His desired outcome, much like the lady on our GPS does when we've made a wrong turn; the point is that by trusting God, we arrive safely where He intended us all along. There are so many Bible characters that illustrate this very principle.

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    curly sue (01-30-2016)

  13. #19
    Bookie, I understand your heart, but both sides don't necessarily share the idea about walking in faith. Faith has much to do with the how when understands God's character. If one if of the idea that God is the "first-cause" of everything that happens then it is difficult for many people to have faith for relief from whatever difficulties they encounter.

    Furthermore, if one defines faith as the average Calvinist does - i.e., trust that God has a purpose for your tragedy or difficulty or He would never have "ordained" or "allowed" it to happen in the first place, then it goes against the Biblical idea of faith as taught by Jesus, which is to confront and command the removal of your difficulty (Mark 11:22-14).

    Therefore, these little quibbles will probably continue on because I personally will never compromise the truth of God's Word for the sake of "peace."
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    Colonel (01-31-2016)

  15. #20
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    Brilliant !

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