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Thread: Talking to Dead Saints

  1. #21
    Frozen Chosen A.J.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John View Post
    This is touching on the topic of "counsel", why would the Lord use dead people (even in a vision) to give you counsel when we know that it is absolutely forbidden to seek counsel from them. Again, why would he violate His own commands?

    The spirit is subject to the prophet so you can't just say...Oh, I was sleeping, didn't ask for that, that's not biblical either. Will dead folks show up in dreams? Sure, but in light of scripture we should reject their "counsel" as not being of the Lord. We are not passive vessels but have faculty, and counsel from the word of God.
    The point is, God can use whatever/whomever He wants. WE, as humans, are forbidden to SEEK counsel from the dead. Big difference.

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  3. #22
    So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed. John's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by A.J. View Post
    The point is, God can use whatever/whomever He wants. WE, as humans, are forbidden to SEEK counsel from the dead. Big difference.
    So what you are saying is that if we are asleep, dreaming or in a trance that we can accept counsel from the dead?

    Don't we need to take every thought captive, examine it in light of scripture?

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  5. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by John View Post
    So what you are saying is that if we are asleep, dreaming or in a trance that we can accept counsel from the dead?

    Don't we need to take every thought captive, examine it in light of scripture?
    We, at least I, don't have control over what/who shows up in my dreams.

    So what if a donkey shows up in your dreams and starts talking. Accept it because God used a donkey in scripture? What about some other animal? The occult uses animals all the time, so do we automatically think the dream has an occult base because an animal told us to go left instead of right in our dreams?

    John, I really think you're over thinking this.

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  7. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by A.J. View Post
    We, at least I, don't have control over what/who shows up in my dreams.

    So what if a donkey shows up in your dreams and starts talking. Accept it because God used a donkey in scripture? What about some other animal? The occult uses animals all the time, so do we automatically think the dream has an occult base because an animal told us to go left instead of right in our dreams?

    John, I really think you're over thinking this.
    No, just observing what is being taught in church, that anything goes when it comes to dreams, visions and trances. Shouldn't they be subject to normal examination? Dead people talking to me in my dreams is apparently AOK, I can receive that as being of the Lord when we know that He really doesn't want us talking to or listening to dead people. Special pass because you didn't ask for it?

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  9. #25
    Frozen Chosen A.J.'s Avatar
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    Dreams are totally different than the conscious mind and I THINK you already know that.

    Visions also take us out of the conscious mind, from what I understand, although we can still be conscious of what's happening but I THINK you already know that, too.

    And some things that God shows us need to be pondered and prayed about for awhile, which I believe is different from what you're suggesting. HE will validate when we ask HIM.

    You're very black and white on things, aren't you.

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  11. #26
    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
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    I was asleep and dreaming once and then I saw a huge black dog inside that dream with razor sharp clarity and I instantly became totally conscious and aware of it, then I awoke to completely different surroundings. I have also become fully conscious within dreams without God having anything to do with it, which lead to waking up within not so long. So these things aren't necessarily clearly categorizable.

    Most of my really powerful encounters with God have involved being completely awake and with full clarity of mind, no altered states of mind or anything like that. Just sheer clarity. Kind of like "that is a glory cloud, that is the power of God, that is the power of God altering what I'm looking directly at" etc

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  13. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by A.J. View Post
    Dreams are totally different than the conscious mind and I THINK you already know that.

    Visions also take us out of the conscious mind, from what I understand, although we can still be conscious of what's happening but I THINK you already know that, too.

    And some things that God shows us need to be pondered and prayed about for awhile, which I believe is different from what you're suggesting. HE will validate when we ask HIM.

    You're very black and white on things, aren't you.
    black and white..narrow minded...

    well, let's see here, we have the whole counsel of God, that's quite expansive so I don't see how you could make a dig like that. I'm just coming up empty scripturally on the dead people thing. I can't find scripture that approves of that, asleep or otherwise.

    I am hearing a lot of wiggly stuff but nothing from the word. I prefer to think of it as "sound mind", submitting my thoughts/beliefs to scripture. Of course some would consider that "old wineskin" stuff, they are not content in the garden.

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  15. #28
    Frozen Chosen A.J.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John View Post
    black and white..narrow minded...

    well, let's see here, we have the whole counsel of God, that's quite expansive so I don't see how you could make a dig like that. I'm just coming up empty scripturally on the dead people thing. I can't find scripture that approves of that, asleep or otherwise.
    Black and white is different than narrow minded, IMO. It wasn't meant as a dig. Just an observation of someone I only know through internet interaction.

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  17. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by A.J. View Post
    Black and white is different than narrow minded, IMO. It wasn't meant as a dig. Just an observation of someone I only know through internet interaction.
    a dig is a dig...

    Thank you.

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  19. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by John View Post
    a dig is a dig...

    Thank you.
    Interpret it as you wish. It was not meant as a dig.

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