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Thread: The parable of the sower

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    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
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    The parable of the sower

    I mentioned Romans 11:13-24 as an extremely clear anti-OSAS passage previously. There's an other one from the gospels, if one reads it equally straight. There are several accounts, so I'll try to include the details from all.

    The parable of the sower. The seed that falls by the wayside and the seed that falls into good soil isn't that interesting in this context but the other two are.

    Luke 8:6 Some fell on rock; and as soon as it sprang up, it withered away because it lacked moisture.
    Mark 4:5 Some fell on stony ground, where it did not have much earth; and immediately it sprang up because it had no depth of earth. 6 But when the sun was up it was scorched, and because it had no root it withered away.
    Mat 13:5 Some fell on stony places, where they did not have much earth; and they immediately sprang up because they had no depth of earth. 6 But when the sun was up they were scorched, and because they had no root they withered away.

    Luke 8:13 But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away.
    Mark 4:16 These likewise are the ones sown on stony ground who, when they hear the word, immediately receive it with gladness; 17 and they have no root in themselves, and so endure only for a time. Afterward, when tribulation or persecution arises for the word’s sake, immediately they stumble.
    Mat 13:20 But he who received the seed on stony places, this is he who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy; 21 yet he has no root in himself, but endures only for a while. For when tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he stumbles.

    Whereas the seed sown by the wayside never springs up but is trampled down and then devoured by birds, this seed that is sown on stony ground does spring up. It has life. It doesn't manage to lay down a root and find moisture so it soon withers and dies.
    Matthew and Mark aren't clear about the spiritual nature of the person involved but Luke is clear, the person does believe for a while but because he has no depth in himself and there is no flow of living water, he falls away when temptations, tribulations and persecutions come.
    The fact that the seed sprouts life and that the person is said to believe, proves that the person was born again for a while before becoming spiritually dead agin.

    Luke 8:7 And some fell among thorns, and the thorns sprang up with it and choked it.
    Mark 4:7 And some seed fell among thorns; and the thorns grew up and choked it, and it yielded no crop.
    Mat 13:7 And some fell among thorns, and the thorns sprang up and choked them.

    Luke 8:14 Now the ones that fell among thorns are those who, when they have heard, go out and are choked with cares, riches, and pleasures of life, and bring no fruit to maturity.
    Mark 4:18 Now these are the ones sown among thorns; they are the ones who hear the word, 19 and the cares of this world, the deceitfulness of riches, and the desires for other things entering in choke the word, and it becomes unfruitful.
    Mat 13:22 Now he who received seed among the thorns is he who hears the word, and the cares of this world and the deceitfulness of riches choke the word, and he becomes unfruitful.

    The thorns choke the plant but that doesn't mean that it dies, it merely doesn't produce a crop. An unfruitful Christian but still a born again believer. Mark and Matthew mention the deceitfulness of riches but Luke says that the person is choked by riches and pleasures of life as such. What does that mean ? It resembles the passage where Paul warns those who get married that they will have trouble in the flesh. Which is often interpreted as getting reasons to be angry etc but it could as well mean getting too entangled with the positive side to it. In the next verses he mentions both marriage and riches :

    1 Cor 7:29 But this I say, brethren, the time is short, so that from now on even those who have wives should be as though they had none, 30 those who weep as though they did not weep, those who rejoice as though they did not rejoice, those who buy as though they did not possess, 31 and those who use this world as not misusing it. For the form of this world is passing away.

    How many of the four end up in heaven ? The last two, if they don't change scenarios. The one sown among thorns and the one sown in good soil. What happens when the one sown among thorns and is largely unfruitful faces temptation, tribulation, persecution ? He may well have a deep root and may manage to withstand all of that, just as my relative that I mentioned previously seems to be doing successfully even though his wife hates the fact that he is a Christian. But the scenarios aren't set in stone and the choked plant is certainly in a weaker position to endure than the one sown in good soil.

    How many of the four are saved initially ? The last three, including the one sown on stony ground. He falls away by ceasing to believe and becoming spiritually dead again. The logic involved in the agricultural picture is clear, just as it is in Romans 11:13-24.

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    Super Moderator Quest's Avatar
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    Yes..springing up means they had some root but not deep enough to strengthen them for the struggles....some are not developing s strong root system. yes some fall with things as they are now...the dily relationship building is that rot system...

    I was pondering the cursed fig tree...how the fig produces fruit and then leaves...so when Jesus expected to find fruit because the leaves were present and did not the tree was deemed worthless...I see this as a parallel...we can look good on the outside but have no substantial internal transformation that produces actual fruit...

    This is a sad place because I believe some babies are born and try to mimick the external look of Christians but are not led by their peers to the true place of transformation...the intimate personal relationship...

    Ho many discipleship programs start out by teaching the 'rules' the dos and don'ts...the history...but not beginning with the most crucial of all ...learning to hear and recognize the voice of the the Holy Spirit, HIS leading...sad

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    Super Moderator Quest's Avatar
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    PS...yes I do believe this parable makes clear one has some roots but withers is speaking addressing the reality that OSAS is false..warning ....

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    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quest View Post
    PS...yes I do believe this parable makes clear one has some roots but withers is speaking addressing the reality that OSAS is false..warning ....
    Yet another passage dealing with loss of faith and returning to spiritual death, in detail and clarity.

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    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
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    Here's a related passage. It's similar to Romans 11:13-24 because the branches are connected to a root from where the sap flows.

    John 15:1 “I am the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser.
    2 Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He takes away; and every branch that bears fruit He prunes, that it may bear more fruit.

    If we compare to the seed sown among thorns they aren't entirely similar. Those seeds spring up and bear at least some fruit, just not something worthy of a crop. They aren't totally fruitless. Many Christians are caught up in the affairs of this world and never try to be a witness but God can and does use them a little bit because Christ is in them by his Holy Spirit. They aren't spiritually dead, just largely fruitless.
    In the verse above he's referring to a branch that bears no fruit whatsoever. It has lost its connection to the lifegiving sap from the root. It's spiritually dead and is severed from the tree because it cannot be revived. No "Holy Ghost defibrillator" can be applied, it's just a decaying corpse.

    3 You are already clean because of the word which I have spoken to you.
    4 Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in Me.
    5 “I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing.
    6 If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned.

    In Romans 11:13-24 the branches that were cut off because of unbelief could be grafted in again if they repented so the gathering in to be thrown into the fire isn't immediate, it's the final destination of those who do not repent.

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