Thread: Jesus Destroys the "T" in TULIP

Originally Posted by Ezekiel 33

By the mouth of 2 or 3 witnesses a matter is established.

The bible teaches that whoever calls upon the name of the LORD shall be saved.

Quite true but the Bible also says:

1. Then God said, "Let Us make man in Our image,
2. God said to Noah, "The end of all flesh has come before Me ...Make for yourself an ark of gopher wood; you shall ...
3. Now when Abram was ninety-nine years old, the Lord appeared to Abram and said to him, "I am God Almighty; Walk before Me, and be blameless
4. Sarah your wife will bear you a son, and you shall call his name Isaac; and I will establish My covenant with him
5. But the children struggled together within her; and she said, "If it is so, why then am I this way?" So she went to inquire of the Lord. ²³ The Lord said to her, "Two nations are in your womb; And two peoples will be separated from your body; And one people shall be stronger than the other;
6. And the older shall serve the younger."
7. Therefore, come now, and I will send you (Moses) to Pharaoh, so that you may bring My people, the sons of Israel, out of Egypt."
8. Fill your horn with oil and go; I will send you to Jesse the Bethlehemite, for I have selected a king for Myself among his sons
9. Now in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God to a city in Galilee called Nazareth, to a virgin ... he said to her, "Greetings, favored one! The Lord is with you." ...The angel said to her, "Do not be afraid, Mary; for you have found favor with God. And behold, you will conceive in your womb and bear a son
10. Jesus was walking by the Sea of Galilee, He saw two brothers, ... And He said to them, "Follow Me, and I will make you fishers of men."
11. As he was traveling, it happened that he was approaching Damascus, and suddenly a light from heaven flashed around him; and he fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to him, "Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?" And he said, "Who are You, Lord?" And He said, "I am Jesus whom you are persecuting, but get up and enter the city, and it will be told you what you must do."

1. he is a chosen instrument of Mine, to bear My name before the Gentiles
2. witnesses who were chosen beforehand by God
3. What Israel is seeking, it has not obtained, but those who were chosen obtained it, and the rest were hardened;
4. God has chosen the foolish things of the world to shame the wise, and God has chosen the weak things of the world to shame the things which are strong
5. as those who have been chosen of God, holy and beloved
6. because God has chosen you from the beginning for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and faith in the truth
7. I endure all things for the sake of those who are chosen, so that they also may obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus
8. Paul, a bond-servant of God and an apostle of Jesus Christ, for the faith of those chosen of God
9. To those who reside as aliens, scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia, who are chosen
10. She who is in Babylon, chosen together with you, sends you greetings
11. He is Lord of lords and King of kings, and those who are with Him are the called and chosen and faithful
12. but for the sake of the elect, whom He chose, He shortened the days
13. you did not choose Me but I chose you, and appointed you
14. but I chose you out of the world, because of this the world hates you
15. The God of this people Israel chose our fathers and made the people great during their stay in the land of Egypt
16. He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world
17. did not God choose the poor of this world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom

The Bible also teaches that while whoever calls upon the name of the Lord shall be saved only the elect are able to call upon the name of the Lord.

Originally Posted by FunFromOz

Not necessarily Femme*, but as I've posted elsewhere this area of Scripture touches the area of pride so things can get sensitive.

Pride ? I'd say that believing that God would select me as a sinner from among other sinners to be saved would give me every reason to see myself as oh so special in relation to my surroundings. My natural reaction since watching the phenomenon from my early school days and on is to hate favoritism whether it is being applied to someone else or it is applied to myself, including when it is being applied positively to myself. Favoritism is essentially a matter of disrespecting both the one treated positively and the one treated negatively, making both pawns in a game of favoritism. Just because the authority in question had the power to carry through with the favoritism and noone above that person knew or bothered about it, doesn't make it right. This works the same way with God, I fear him because of his character and not merely because I perceive that he has power. The Bible condemns favoritism and also tells us that God does not show favoritism so that tells me a lot about God's character. It is holy.

if you, truly, think that being elect is a reason for pride, you've missed the whole, entire point.
it's humbling, it mashes you to the soul and makes you cry out in amazement that out of all of humanity He should take notice of me.

God chose Noah, He chose Abraham, He chose -- He chose --
they didn't choose Him, He chose them.

Look at Paul. stopped dead in the middle of the road and made blind. He THOUGHT he was choosing God, but God pointed out that he wasn't.

Originally Posted by Femme*

God chose Noah, He chose Abraham, He chose -- He chose --
they didn't choose Him, He chose them.

Look at Paul. stopped dead in the middle of the road and made blind. He THOUGHT he was choosing God, but God pointed out that he wasn't.

Which is the point of my post three up.

Originally Posted by FunFromOz

Quite true but the Bible also says:

1. Then God said, "Let Us make man in Our image,
2. God said to Noah, "The end of all flesh has come before Me ...Make for yourself an ark of gopher wood; you shall ...
3. Now when Abram was ninety-nine years old, the Lord appeared to Abram and said to him, "I am God Almighty; Walk before Me, and be blameless
4. Sarah your wife will bear you a son, and you shall call his name Isaac; and I will establish My covenant with him
5. But the children struggled together within her; and she said, "If it is so, why then am I this way?" So she went to inquire of the Lord. ²³ The Lord said to her, "Two nations are in your womb; And two peoples will be separated from your body; And one people shall be stronger than the other;
6. And the older shall serve the younger."
7. Therefore, come now, and I will send you (Moses) to Pharaoh, so that you may bring My people, the sons of Israel, out of Egypt."
8. Fill your horn with oil and go; I will send you to Jesse the Bethlehemite, for I have selected a king for Myself among his sons
9. Now in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God to a city in Galilee called Nazareth, to a virgin ... he said to her, "Greetings, favored one! The Lord is with you." ...The angel said to her, "Do not be afraid, Mary; for you have found favor with God. And behold, you will conceive in your womb and bear a son
10. Jesus was walking by the Sea of Galilee, He saw two brothers, ... And He said to them, "Follow Me, and I will make you fishers of men."
11. As he was traveling, it happened that he was approaching Damascus, and suddenly a light from heaven flashed around him; and he fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to him, "Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?" And he said, "Who are You, Lord?" And He said, "I am Jesus whom you are persecuting, but get up and enter the city, and it will be told you what you must do."

1. he is a chosen instrument of Mine, to bear My name before the Gentiles
2. witnesses who were chosen beforehand by God
3. What Israel is seeking, it has not obtained, but those who were chosen obtained it, and the rest were hardened;
4. God has chosen the foolish things of the world to shame the wise, and God has chosen the weak things of the world to shame the things which are strong
5. as those who have been chosen of God, holy and beloved
6. because God has chosen you from the beginning for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and faith in the truth
7. I endure all things for the sake of those who are chosen, so that they also may obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus
8. Paul, a bond-servant of God and an apostle of Jesus Christ, for the faith of those chosen of God
9. To those who reside as aliens, scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia, who are chosen
10. She who is in Babylon, chosen together with you, sends you greetings
11. He is Lord of lords and King of kings, and those who are with Him are the called and chosen and faithful
12. but for the sake of the elect, whom He chose, He shortened the days
13. you did not choose Me but I chose you, and appointed you
14. but I chose you out of the world, because of this the world hates you
15. The God of this people Israel chose our fathers and made the people great during their stay in the land of Egypt
16. He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world
17. did not God choose the poor of this world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom

The Bible also teaches that while whoever calls upon the name of the Lord shall be saved only the elect are able to call upon the name of the Lord.

The "elect" are the whomsoever is thirsty may drink of the well of water.

That sounds exactly like what the school children who were being favored positively would use as an excuse for accepting the differing treatment.

Originally Posted by Femme*

if you, truly, think that being elect is a reason for pride, you've missed the whole, entire point.
it's humbling, it mashes you to the soul and makes you cry out in amazement that out of all of humanity He should take notice of me.

God chose Noah, He chose Abraham, He chose -- He chose --
they didn't choose Him, He chose them.

Look at Paul. stopped dead in the middle of the road and made blind. He THOUGHT he was choosing God, but God pointed out that he wasn't.

Originally Posted by FunFromOz

Which is the point of my post three up.

We've discussed that previously. Good called Paul in order to get others saved, not because he was oh so special in God's eyes and therefore he had to regenerate him more spectacularly than anyone else or something like that.

Originally Posted by Colonel

We've discussed that previously. Good called Paul in order to get others saved, not because he was oh so special in God's eyes and therefore he had to regenerate him more spectacularly than anyone else or something like that.

Like the rest of us Paul was God's "workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them" (Eph 2:10). Paul just had a lot more to do then most of us, but then God made him for that purpose.

Originally Posted by FunFromOz

Like the rest of us Paul was God's "workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them" (Eph 2:10). Paul just had a lot more to do then most of us, but then God made him for that purpose.

He still had to believe, he chose to obey when Ananians told him to be baptized and call upon the name of the Lord and he still had to be obedient to the vision which included being sent to preach the gospel.

Originally Posted by Colonel

He still had to believe, he chose to obey when Ananians told him to be baptized and call upon the name of the Lord and he still had to be obedient to the vision which included being sent to preach the gospel.

Yep, which he was now able to do because God having chosen him regenerated him.