Thread: Jeremiah 29:11 and the Health and Wealth Gospel

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One of the most important rules of biblical interpretation is to study every text in its context. But various groups, such as the prosperity teachers, the name it and claim it crowd, the positive confessionists, and the health and wealth gospellers, love to run with this text while completely ignoring from whence it came.

Thus they will use this as a proof text as they claim it is God's will for all his people to always be rich and well off, and that we should only think happy, positive thoughts, and never dwell on the negative. If this verse had no context, perhaps these folks could get away with such interpretations.

But it most certainly does have a context.
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Gotta love scripture when it's explained by a Godly teacher, not a wolf.

https://billmuehlenberg.com/2016/08/...wealth-gospel/

Unfortunately for you, we are supposed to receive what Jesus did for us which includes speaking what He says about us, thinking what He says about us, acting on what He says about us as this is giving honor and glory until the Lord as we put off the old man and put on the new man which is created in righteousness and true holiness

Philippians 4:6-8
Be careful for nothing; but in every thing by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known unto God.
And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall keep your hearts and minds through Christ Jesus.
Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.

Like it or not, Jesus and Paul taught "word of faith"... but this simply means to lay hold upon that which Jesus paid for us to have which includes health, having enough money to live decently (includes working and giving), as well as mental / emotional health, divine protection (if we are were God has instructed us to be), etc... Brother Troy can tell ya more if you need help in these areas.

Romans 10:6-11
But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above:)
Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)
But what saith it? (the righteousness which is of faith) The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation (deliverance).
For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be ashamed.

Mark 11:22-26
And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God.
For verily I say unto you, That whosoever shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith.
Therefore I say unto you (Jesus just acted on His own teaching!), What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them.
And when ye stand praying, forgive, if ye have ought against any: that your Father also which is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses.
But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses.

I understand that some TV preachers have gone way, way overboard but none the less... Jesus is FOR His people being victorious in every area of their life believe it or not.

Besides, I wouldn't get too down on "word of faith" since this is used to get born again... one must claim the salvation Jesus purchased as being applicable to them.

Originally Posted by Farm Truck

Like it or not, Jesus and Paul taught "word of faith"... but this simply means to lay hold upon that which Jesus paid for us to have which includes health, having enough money to live decently (includes working and giving), as well as mental / emotional health,

Both Jesus and Paul had a few problems here.

Yes, and the Lord delivered them out of them all.
Too many Christians lay down and let satan walk all over them while Jesus says occupy till I come (Luke 19:13)

Of course the world is full of darkness and there will be many challenges to our faith, but we should rebel against satan who is seeking who he may devour (1 Peter 5:8), we should submit to God resisting the devil forcing him to flee (James 4:7)

It's so sad that a lot of Christians are being led in to the ditch on the defeated side as though we are to be defeated in this life.

If I were a sinner out in the world looking at some Christians... I wouldn't want to get saved either.

Besides... Jesus Christ is our role model to pattern our life after and He walked in total victory... untill He willingly laid down His life. If His calling had not been to go to the Cross, they never would have ever, ever laid a finger on His.

They tried to kill Him numerous times and He's just walk away

Originally Posted by victoryword

Excellent posts Farm Truck.

Thanks, I do what I can... now with at least trying not to offend too many. Which I guess means repeat what God says in His Word and then don't say anything if / when people contradict what God says. It's hard to not say anything when God's Word is not being spoken.

Sure, the prosperity part of the Gospel has been taken way out of bounds by some resulting in a pendulum swing into the ditch on the other side which is just as bad as abusing God's desire to prosper His people.

Seems to me the narrow path Jesus spoke of includes a the balance spoken of in Proverbs 11:1 and Proverbs 16:11 as to not be in the ditch on either side.

I know I have been rich and I have been poor and rich is better.... as long as the presence of the Lord is first and foremost in my life. When I grew to that point, I found out that the Lord wanted checking privileges as in the money and stuff is not for me... it's for Him to use to establish His covenant (Deuteronomy 8:18) to support His ministry in the earth.

It's too bad that some see outlandish stuff by TV preachers and allow satan to talk them in to believing God wants them to live on barely get by avenue. But, I do understand why some would go there... I would as well if I was not a Word guy.

I so appreciate God's Word... I don't have to try and figure stuff out, all I gotta do is go learn what God said and follow that and prosperity follows of which money and material stuff is actually the lowest form of prosperity... the presence (Holy Ghost on the inside!) is the unltimate definition of prosperity

Originally Posted by Farm Truck

Sure, the prosperity part of the Gospel has been taken way out of bounds by some

Which is why I said "Gotta love scripture when it's explained by a Godly teacher, not a wolf."

Yes, and some of the so-called "godly teachers" are in the ditch on the other side and teach God does not want His people to be prosperous in every area of their lives... you know, the old "you never know what God's gonna do" teachers.

Originally Posted by Farm Truck

Yes, and some of the so-called "godly teachers" are in the ditch on the other side and teach God does not want His people to be prosperous in every area of their lives... you know, the old "you never know what God's gonna do" teachers.

They are not going "to be prosperous in every area of their lives" if they continue in sin FT, that's one area where God does not want them to prosper in. And that's the context of this verse and it can't be used otherwise else the preacher is deceiving those who are listening to him.

"This passage, like the entire book of Jeremiah, is filled with the language of repentance. It is only when the people turn back to God and seek him afresh that the promise of verse 11 holds true. Yet how many Christian teachers today claim this verse for themselves and their followers, yet never say a word about repentance, and never say a word about the context of this verse: the just judgment of God on a rebellious and sinful people.

The positive confession teachers and the health and wealth gospellers just want to accentuate the positive and ignore the other vital – if not painful – truths of Scripture: the wrath of God, sin, divine holiness, and the need for repentance. A quick release from captivity – and divine judgment – would not be forthcoming, but turning back to Yahweh would see them eventually released."

The first WoF preacher I heard was at a church camp in 1973; I remember two things:
a) Telling barking dogs to be quiet "in Jesus' name" doesn't work
b) The speaker wouldn't speak on the verse "you are gods" as we weren't all pastors.

In Eden Eve was asked if she wanted to be like God?
In the RCC the Pope claimed to be Jesus on earth.
In these post Reformation days WoF asks do you want to be like God being able to create with your words?

There's a pattern there.