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Thread: Is Satan the god of the old testament?

  1. #1

    Lightbulb Is Satan the god of the old testament?

    855 Is Old Testament God Satan Part 1 - YouTube


    Apologetics, Soteriology, Hermenautics, and others of study in our faith are fascinating. I think one could study all their life and never come to the end.
    Which is why this video is intriguing. Especially the part about physics and wave forms.

    However, the reason I'm posting this for others opinions is this.
    Have you noticed the difference in the personality and teachings between God of the old testament and God of the new? God of the old speaks of eye for an eye.
    Jesus, who was God, in the new testament recalls that, "you have been told an eye for an eye...." yet offers instead, "But I tell you, do not resist an evil person....."

    Satan in the old testament is allowed by God to test Job's faith. Satan, which translates as adversary, isn't God's adversary but Job's. Because Satan entered heaven on occasion and conferred with God. As in the case of Job's trials.

    Interesting question here and with regard to the video content above.

    What if the world is more fallen today than ever before despite our savior having come to earth with the good news is such because we've been led to follow the wrong teachings? And venerate the wrong creator. Worshiping instead what is actually the Devil and not God.

    One of the proofs of the true Messiah in Judaism is that his appearance would result in world peace. He wasn't meant to be worshiped, according to Jewish tradition. Rather, he was meant to fill the world with knowledge and bring people into the awareness of the one God.

    And yet, none of that has been accomplished in these 2000+ years since Jesus.

    I look forward to your thoughts. We are told to study so as to give an answer to any who ask us why we hold to our faith. 1 Peter 3:15. I think this question for consideration will benefit us in that regard.

    God Bless.
    "Sometimes the devil allows people to live a life free of trouble because he doesn't want people turning to God. Their sin is like a jail cell, except it is all nice and comfy and there doesn't seem to be any reason to leave. The door's wide open. Till one day time runs out and the door slams shut and suddenly it's too late to get out."
    (Lenore Banks ~ "God's Not Dead")

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  3. #2
    Senior Member Smitty's Avatar
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    Jesus told His disciples in John 14:30;

    "I will not speak much more with you, for the ruler of this world is coming, and he has nothing in Me.

    As I examine myself in my morning devotions, I always ask myself, does the devil have anything in me? Have I given him a legal right to accuse me?
    As I continue to keep the door closed and give "no place to the devil" (Eph 4:27) in my life, I can say what Jesus said, "he has nothing in me."
    If you put God First, you have Him at Last.

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  5. #3
    Senior Member Cardinal TT's Avatar
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    satan isn't the God of the OT

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  7. #4
    Jesus is the God of the Old Testament:

    John 5:39
    Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

    Luke 24:27
    27 And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.
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  9. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Biblemouse View Post
    855 Is Old Testament God Satan Part 1 - YouTube


    Apologetics, Soteriology, Hermenautics, and others of study in our faith are fascinating. I think one could study all their life and never come to the end.
    Which is why this video is intriguing. Especially the part about physics and wave forms.

    However, the reason I'm posting this for others opinions is this.
    Have you noticed the difference in the personality and teachings between God of the old testament and God of the new? God of the old speaks of eye for an eye.
    Jesus, who was God, in the new testament recalls that, "you have been told an eye for an eye...." yet offers instead, "But I tell you, do not resist an evil person....."

    Satan in the old testament is allowed by God to test Job's faith. Satan, which translates as adversary, isn't God's adversary but Job's. Because Satan entered heaven on occasion and conferred with God. As in the case of Job's trials.

    Interesting question here and with regard to the video content above.

    What if the world is more fallen today than ever before despite our savior having come to earth with the good news is such because we've been led to follow the wrong teachings? And venerate the wrong creator. Worshiping instead what is actually the Devil and not God.

    One of the proofs of the true Messiah in Judaism is that his appearance would result in world peace. He wasn't meant to be worshiped, according to Jewish tradition. Rather, he was meant to fill the world with knowledge and bring people into the awareness of the one God.

    And yet, none of that has been accomplished in these 2000+ years since Jesus.

    I look forward to your thoughts. We are told to study so as to give an answer to any who ask us why we hold to our faith. 1 Peter 3:15. I think this question for consideration will benefit us in that regard.

    God Bless.
    I have heard people before argue that there are two "lords" in the Old Testament. There is still much study to be done on that. However, since as in my post above, Scripture speaks of Christ as being the focus of the Old Testament then I certainly must outright reject the idea that Satan is the god of it, and therefore cannot be the focus. He is the god of this world only due to the fact that fallen men are blinded and deceived by him and willingly obey him. But he is no true god, only a fallen angel. Revelation 20 shows us that one day he will he no longer be a concern.

    Job, when interpreted correctly, shows that Satan is an adversary to both Yahweh and man. Adversary does NOT mean EQUAL. God is Satan (Lucifer's) Creator. From a power perspective He could destroy Satan easily. However, God has chosen to respect free-will and earn the trust of men and angels, not by exerting power like a tyrant, but by allowing Satan some freedom to make accusations against both God and men (Satan accused God of bribing Job in order to receive his loyalty). It is because God allows this freedom thatmen and devils can be an adversary to Him.

    However, the Old Testament is primarily focused on God working through men to bring about His plan of redemption because He deeply loves the human race.
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  11. #6
    Senior Member diakonos777's Avatar
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    Ephesians 6:12 (KJV) For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

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  13. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by victoryword View Post
    I have heard people before argue that there are two "lords" in the Old Testament. There is still much study to be done on that. However, since as in my post above, Scripture speaks of Christ as being the focus of the Old Testament then I certainly must outright reject the idea that Satan is the god of it, and therefore cannot be the focus. He is the god of this world only due to the fact that fallen men are blinded and deceived by him and willingly obey him. But he is no true god, only a fallen angel. Revelation 20 shows us that one day he will he no longer be a concern.

    Job, when interpreted correctly, shows that Satan is an adversary to both Yahweh and man. Adversary does NOT mean EQUAL. God is Satan (Lucifer's) Creator. From a power perspective He could destroy Satan easily. However, God has chosen to respect free-will and earn the trust of men and angels, not by exerting power like a tyrant, but by allowing Satan some freedom to make accusations against both God and men (Satan accused God of bribing Job in order to receive his loyalty). It is because God allows this freedom thatmen and devils can be an adversary to Him.

    However, the Old Testament is primarily focused on God working through men to bring about His plan of redemption because He deeply loves the human race.

    How many here watched the OP video?

    Satan is Lord of this world by God's permission. Satan, as we're told in scripture, can do nothing without God allowing it. Satan isn't God's adversary, he's ours. As God allows.

    And his being cast out of Heaven didn't insure he could never return. He can , has, and does, and confers with God. Remember Job?
    "Sometimes the devil allows people to live a life free of trouble because he doesn't want people turning to God. Their sin is like a jail cell, except it is all nice and comfy and there doesn't seem to be any reason to leave. The door's wide open. Till one day time runs out and the door slams shut and suddenly it's too late to get out."
    (Lenore Banks ~ "God's Not Dead")

  14. #8
    Administrator fuego's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Biblemouse View Post
    Satan is Lord of this world by God's permission. Satan, as we're told in scripture, can do nothing without God allowing it.
    Well, without Adam actually allowing it.

    Satan, as we're told in scripture, can do nothing without God allowing it.
    Where is that verse? And God 'allowing' is a whole subject in itself about what that actually means, and connected to my first answer above. I'll let VW, either one of them, take that up with you.

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  16. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by fuego View Post
    Well, without Adam actually allowing it.
    Where is that verse? And God 'allowing' is a whole subject in itself about what that actually means, and connected to my first answer above. I'll let VW, either one of them, take that up with you.
    If we accept God is sovereign, it is therefore God allowing it.

    Job 1 and particularly verse 6.

    Satan is not God's adversary he is our adversary within the domain of Omniscient Omnipresent God.

    What the Bible says about Satan's power Limited by God
    "Sometimes the devil allows people to live a life free of trouble because he doesn't want people turning to God. Their sin is like a jail cell, except it is all nice and comfy and there doesn't seem to be any reason to leave. The door's wide open. Till one day time runs out and the door slams shut and suddenly it's too late to get out."
    (Lenore Banks ~ "God's Not Dead")

  17. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Biblemouse View Post
    How many here watched the OP video?

    Satan is Lord of this world by God's permission. Satan, as we're told in scripture, can do nothing without God allowing it. Satan isn't God's adversary, he's ours. As God allows.

    And his being cast out of Heaven didn't insure he could never return. He can , has, and does, and confers with God. Remember Job?
    I understand the frustration of people replying without watching a video. On a discussion forum people usually only want to discuss what is directly in the OP. Therefore, the title and summary in your OP was enough to trigger our responses.

    Now, I can see that your mind is made up and debate would be a waste of time. But here is a (somewhat) quick response. First, you appeal only to Job to support your view but Scripture must interpret itself. Jesus said that when Satan lies he speaks of his own (John 8:44). God does not need to give satan "permission" to lie. In Ezekiel 28 God says iniquity was FOUND (discovered) in Satan. Again, no "permission" involved.

    Even in Job 1 itself God asks Satan where he has been and Satan says that he has been to and fro throughout the earth. If Satan needed God's permission then why would God need to ask? Only concerning the attacks on Job in particular did Satan need God to "allow" him due to there being a protective hedge around Job. Not everyone on earth has God's protective hedge, therefore, Satan does not need God's "permission" to attack everyone. Furthermore, Satan did not consult God on the specifics of each attack.

    Satan is "lord" of the earth only because mankind has abdicated his delegated authority and MEN have allowed Satan to reign through deception (2 Cor. 4:4; Rev. 12:9-11). This is NOT God's doing but men. God gave men authority and MAN gave it to Satan (Gen. 1:27-28; Psalm 8; Luke 4). Jesus gave us that authority back (Luke 10:17-20).
    Christ's Victory Bible Teaching Center
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