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Thread: Prophetic ministry

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by FunFromOz View Post
    There are some good reasons for thinking FireBrand. For instance when

    1) You're aware from Scripture that churches can fall away from the truth (see Rev 2-3), and
    2) You read that "Tracing the state of evangelicalism from the Puritan age to his own era, Shindler noted that every revival of true evangelical faith had been followed within a generation or two by a drift away from sound doctrine, ultimately leading to a wholesale apostasy", and
    3) You've researched a bit about second and third generations "Christians", and
    4) You're aware that the move you were saved in has now gone 2nd / 3rd generation, and
    5) Things are presented to you as Biblical but when you ask for Scriptural (i.e. Doctrinal) support for the statements you get none, then

    you should start to look around and look at the state of the Church and if, as has happened time and time again, it too is drifting away from sound doctrine then you don't go with it.

    One of the measures suggested for deciding if something is truly genuine not is to ask yourself the question: "Can I see the apostles or even Jesus for that matter carrying on like this in the New Testament?" I'll link this video again and I don't know why it doesn't start where I'd like it to, but there's a yellow dot at the 7:19 mark. Start from there. You only have to watch a few seconds to answer the above question.

    So back to the question. With all the cessationist bend you have bent yourself into...what are your personal experiences of flowing in prophetic ministry? Anything recent?

  2. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by FireBrand View Post
    So back to the question. With all the cessationist bend you have bent yourself into...
    Unfortunately this is actually a misunderstanding. I'm not a cessationist, but what I'm concerned about is people doing things, claiming they're exercising Biblical "gifts", but in reality, having drifted away from sound doctrine (e.g. we have the suggestion that 4,000 words written on a gift without any Scriptures quoted in it is adequate support for the gift [that doesn't mean the gift is not valid, just that the support is inadequate. Without Scriptural support, without Scriptural boundaries, people will do anything]) just do "stuff" and no one's game to challenge them because no one has had any real Scripture supported teaching on the subject. And not only do they do "stuff", but they're often wrong and no one seems to care.

    That seems more like a "drifting away" Church than a "NT" Church to me. That's what concerns me.

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  4. #33
    I agree, there's an enormous middle ground between cessationism and "accepting anything."

    I believe there is definitely a time and place for prophecy today. But too many false prophets today are spewing out false prophecies, and too many people swallow them.

    True prophets seem awfully hard to come by today. In fact, I can't name a single one.

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  6. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by MercyandFaith View Post
    I agree, there's an enormous middle ground between cessationism and "accepting anything."

    I believe there is definitely a time and place for prophecy today. But too many false prophets today are spewing out false prophecies, and too many people swallow them.

    True prophets seem awfully hard to come by today. In fact, I can't name a single one.
    I can't find it at the moment, but I read somewhere recently where someone said that the latest one they know of would be A.W. Tozer.

    However a possibility is that people start off OK but are caught up in one of the 3G's, glory. They start to accept the praises of men (because Christians wouldn't praise the false) and build a following of men.

  7. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by FireBrand View Post
    ...what are your personal experiences of flowing in prophetic ministry? Anything recent?

    As I said, "I'll have to put some thought into how that can be answered", and here's why.


    The first and most important reason is that in the Church I was at for 50 years there was never any oversight given to what, if anything, I ever did in the area of the gifts. In the first decade, for a while at least, anyone who wanted to say anything in a Church service had to run it past "Bob" first, a role he wasn't comfortable with. I never had a need to. Another time at a small group meeting, when someone who always "prophesised" did so I brought up the issue of judging prophesy. He was offended, and the pastor present was no help, suggesting I do it. I had no idea how, having no examples or teaching or whatever.


    On top of that I doubt if there has been much teaching on the gifts over the last 35 years, certainly the last 20, and I don't think I've seen any instances of any of the spoken gifts in that time.


    So anything I've said or done has never been under any supervision or oversight and there's been minimal feedback.


    Based on all that anything I've ever done I can only say that it seemed at the time to be in the area of a gift. No way can I say that anything WAS. Therefore no details will be given.


    Let's continue. Occasional I'll feel I "have a word" for someone. From memory this only happens at small group meetings, and during prayer. I always use words like "I think" or "it seems to me". A couple of times the group leader has said he felt it was right.


    Perhaps in the same vain, occasionally I feel I should go to certain places. Probably more often than I remember. It happened yesterday actually and I believe that I got that right. A couple of times I've felt I should do things, usually quietly but one was very public. I finally asked "why?" on that one.


    But by the same token, I was walking somewhere today, based on going the way I felt I should go, and I was reminded of a time 20 years ago when I thought God said something to me but He didn't.


    Nothing terribly exciting. Nothing earth shattering. Nothing that I could say anything more about than that "I believe that was God". Except for the time when I know it wasn't.

  8. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by MercyandFaith View Post
    True prophets seem awfully hard to come by today. In fact, I can't name a single one.
    It would seem to me that if there was a true prophet there would not need to be lots prophesying who would be POTUS (if that would be covered at all - most of the world doesn't care and it's all done and dusted in a few months, not like when God sent Israel to Babylon for 70 years so had Jeremiah let them know that things would work out OK) and being a true prophet people would believe them and they would believe themselves.

    Surely we'd need only the one known true prophet, or maybe two, and they wouldn't be behaving as they are indicated to be in the video I linked. Surely a true prophet who knew they were right (or else they would be a false prophet) would be able to calmly tell people to just wait and see what God was doing?

  9. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by MercyandFaith View Post
    I agree, there's an enormous middle ground between cessationism and "accepting anything."

    I believe there is definitely a time and place for prophecy today. But too many false prophets today are spewing out false prophecies, and too many people swallow them.

    True prophets seem awfully hard to come by today. In fact, I can't name a single one.
    Kenneth Hagin is mentioned as someone who prophesied accurately beyond his inner circle. Not many are called to be national or international prophetic voices in a very concretely revelatory or predictive manner.

    Todd White had a video a couple of years ago where he talked about spending time with leadership in a large American church where he called out the dirty laundry of a large number of people among the 50 or so that were present and the result was repentance rather than offense. But that's an "inner circle" thing, not something that happened in public.

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  11. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by FunFromOz View Post
    As I said, "I'll have to put some thought into how that can be answered", and here's why.


    The first and most important reason is that in the Church I was at for 50 years there was never any oversight given to what, if anything, I ever did in the area of the gifts. In the first decade, for a while at least, anyone who wanted to say anything in a Church service had to run it past "Bob" first, a role he wasn't comfortable with. I never had a need to. Another time at a small group meeting, when someone who always "prophesised" did so I brought up the issue of judging prophesy. He was offended, and the pastor present was no help, suggesting I do it. I had no idea how, having no examples or teaching or whatever.


    On top of that I doubt if there has been much teaching on the gifts over the last 35 years, certainly the last 20, and I don't think I've seen any instances of any of the spoken gifts in that time.


    So anything I've said or done has never been under any supervision or oversight and there's been minimal feedback.


    Based on all that anything I've ever done I can only say that it seemed at the time to be in the area of a gift. No way can I say that anything WAS. Therefore no details will be given.


    Let's continue. Occasional I'll feel I "have a word" for someone. From memory this only happens at small group meetings, and during prayer. I always use words like "I think" or "it seems to me". A couple of times the group leader has said he felt it was right.


    Perhaps in the same vain, occasionally I feel I should go to certain places. Probably more often than I remember. It happened yesterday actually and I believe that I got that right. A couple of times I've felt I should do things, usually quietly but one was very public. I finally asked "why?" on that one.


    But by the same token, I was walking somewhere today, based on going the way I felt I should go, and I was reminded of a time 20 years ago when I thought God said something to me but He didn't.


    Nothing terribly exciting. Nothing earth shattering. Nothing that I could say anything more about than that "I believe that was God". Except for the time when I know it wasn't.
    That probably qualifies as the least bold testimony that I have ever heard. Are you sure that you haven't been reduced to a CINO, a "Charismatic in name only" ?

  12. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel View Post
    That probably qualifies as the least bold testimony that I have ever heard. Are you sure that you haven't been reduced to a CINO, a "Charismatic in name only" ?
    What do you want me to do? Lie like all the present day false prophets?

    The Church I went to for 47 years went CINO (https://www.imdb.com/title/tt9099674/), then worse.

  13. #40
    There are plenty of true prophets. Most I know are in smaller churches and active in ministry. It isn't easy finding a good church that nurtures the young prophetic ones. Most churches do not teach on the prophetic ministry or the gifts of the Holy Spirit (especially tongues and interpretation). The result is a culture that only knows the "bad" ones. Sad situation really. When I'm not out on a mission assignment (I help troubled churches in a pastoral role) I am part of a church that vibrantly flows in the prophetic gifts.

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