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Thread: Christians voting for democrats???

  1. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Bookman View Post
    In prayerfully voting, we are "rendering unto Caesar that which is Caesar's." Our freedom in this country is a gift of God and we are stewards of that gift. If we don't steward it, we will lose it. To not vote is to despise the gift of freedom. Further, every vote that counts to end or curtail abortion is an important vote. I cannot with a clear conscience stand before God and say I didn't vote to save the lives of the innocent. Voting is a means. It's not God's only means, but it IS a means we must use to God's glory.
    I agree wholeheartedly but this post reads in stark contrast with your initial post ..

  2. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by BAP View Post
    I agree wholeheartedly but this post reads in stark contrast with your initial post ..
    Hmm. Then I must not be expressing myself clearly. Voting is important, but it will not bring revival and revival is the only thing that can truly save us.

  3. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Bookman View Post
    Hmm. Then I must not be expressing myself clearly. Voting is important, but it will not bring revival and revival is the only thing that can truly save us.
    I guess by revival , you mean "religious" revivial where chruches are full with many at the altar .. If so well Plenty of countries exist where the churches are full and that form of revival is going on but the political or socio-cultural impact is slim to none ...

    Furthermore your posts read (correct me if I am wrong) as if WHILE you do see your vote as a way of glorifying God on one hand on the other hand you seemingly dismiss the notion that political/government structures are wholly or partially involved in or reflective of God's ability to move.

    If so then again I ask why bother vote ?

    Here is my point. Revival isn't limited to what goes on in churches . People learning to vote based on Godly principles is itself a form or component of REVIVAL that will impact one of the ESSENTIAL Pillars of GOD'S KINGDOM which is the Government.

    Furthermore there is no point in voting if we don't have any expectations that God can do good through our voting . It's kinda like getting married without expecting a good marriage.

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  5. #14
    People learning to vote based on Godly principles is itself a form or component of REVIVAL that will impact one of the ESSENTIAL Pillars of GOD'S KINGDOM which is the Government.
    I believe for our government to work effectively, it requires implementation by honest men and women who "get" the principles on which the country was founded. We are presently, in my opinion, a corrupt nation and that corruption is found in politics too (as in every other sphere of our culture). There are corrupt liberals and corrupt conservatives. If a truly godly person was elected to office, even most people who call themselves Christians would have a cow over how that person would want to govern. He or she would be "insensitive," "homophobic," "a dinosaur," a "hater," and worse. The media would have a heyday taking down such a person. I think we need revival first among Christians, then watch it spread to communities and hopefully to our elected officials. I will vote conservative, but in so doing, I realize it's like me pouring my cup of water on a raging fire. It's better than throwing a cup of gasoline on the fire (not voting or voting for more liberalization of our nation)...but not much better.

  6. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Bookman View Post
    I believe for our government to work effectively, it requires implementation by honest men and women who "get" the principles on which the country was founded. We are presently, in my opinion, a corrupt nation and that corruption is found in politics too (as in every other sphere of our culture). There are corrupt liberals and corrupt conservatives. If a truly godly person was elected to office, even most people who call themselves Christians would have a cow over how that person would want to govern. He or she would be "insensitive," "homophobic," "a dinosaur," a "hater," and worse. The media would have a heyday taking down such a person. I think we need revival first among Christians, then watch it spread to communities and hopefully to our elected officials. I will vote conservative, but in so doing, I realize it's like me pouring my cup of water on a raging fire. It's better than throwing a cup of gasoline on the fire (not voting or voting for more liberalization of our nation)...but not much better.

    Fair enough . We really dont differ much but I guess where I differ from most is That I am less concerned about individuals than I am about ideology ..because as the book of Habakkuk said ..

    2Then the LORD answered me and said, "Record the vision And inscribe it on tablets, That the one who reads it may run. 3"For the vision is yet for the appointed time; It hastens toward the goal and it will not fail. Though it tarries, wait for it; For it will certainly come, it will not delay.…
    Sometimes the individuals may lag behind the principles or the vision we uphold but in due season both principles and indiviuals will align .

    Also we need to understand as Christians that when dealing with political matters the individuals may not come in the package we expect . Neville Chamberlain was in many ways a far more "Christian" man in personal demeanor than Churchill was but Churchill was closer to God's vision for the time..

    Or for example during the American Civil War you had very Godly men like Stonewall Jackson and Robert E Lee fighghting essentially for an unrighteous cause while you had whoremongers like General "Hooker" and any niumber of Lincolns often Useless Generals fighting essentially for a righteous cause

  7. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bookman View Post
    the gospel I believe is indeed the "gospel of grace."
    They way is is being taught in modern times... is a false gospel, it is another gospel.

    Yes, we are saved by grace THRU FAITH, and therein lies the problem for many since they are starting to reject the Book of James which teaches us that faith without corresponding action is not faith at all, and it teaches that faith alone cannot save us.

    Abraham believed God and it was accounted unto him as righteousness... as Abraham acted as though what he believe was true, which is something the false grace teachers claim is legalism, and so some of them now are try to explain away the Book of James as not being for us today.

    When folks have to remove certain parts of God's Word to make their doctrine sound like it is making sense... you know it is a wolf in sheep's clothing that is teaching this because as spoken of in Jude they are denying (contradicting) the Lord's teachings.

    Check out the teachings of Jesus... He taught the Gospel of the Kingdom of God.

    You get in to the Kingdom by grace thru faith... but once in, are you going to walk with God, or ignore Him and walk after the flesh?

    This is the judgement Jesus will be making on each person who claims to be born-again.

  8. #17
    You get in to the Kingdom by grace thru faith... but once in, are you going to walk with God, or ignore Him and walk after the flesh?
    I believe walking after the flesh can not only refer to overt sins of the body, but also our religious flesh too. And if you read what I wrote in the Piper thread, I don't believe it's possible for a true born again Christian to "ignore" God.

  9. #18
    Super Moderator Quest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bookman View Post
    In prayerfully voting, we are "rendering unto Caesar that which is Caesar's." Our freedom in this country is a gift of God and we are stewards of that gift. If we don't steward it, we will lose it. To not vote is to despise the gift of freedom. Further, every vote that counts to end or curtail abortion is an important vote. I cannot with a clear conscience stand before God and say I didn't vote to save the lives of the innocent. Voting is a means. It's not God's only means, but it IS a means we must use to God's glory.
    Without revival our vote is frivolous...I will prayerfully vote as I did in the past but hold no hope for a President or leadership to turn America back to course...

  10. #19
    Super Moderator Quest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bookman View Post
    I believe walking after the flesh can not only refer to overt sins of the body, but also our religious flesh too. And if you read what I wrote in the Piper thread, I don't believe it's possible for a true born again Christian to "ignore" God.
    If they can say no...yes they can ignore God. And I am sure you can admit to saying NO at least once in your lifetime..

  11. #20
    I think Bookie means ultimately, not saying "no"..

    we can be stubborn and stiffnecked, just like Israel, but, eventually, we will yield. God only let's His own go so far before His discipline comes into play.

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