Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123
Results 21 to 30 of 30

Thread: Multi-Site Church Campuses-Biblical ?

  1. #21
    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Oslo, Norway
    Posts
    14,487
    Thanked: 5793
    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal TT View Post
    They have mostly live preaching but video is a strong part of the church it also includes the video message at the mid-week home meetings

    The worse part of many of these churches imo is you have 1.5 hours to get people in and out for the next meeting.
    Way too structured for myself but many modern believers like that as it's easier to attend and leave.
    You have done your duty, paid your tithes, sung songs, listened to a short message etc.

    I know they still have many very committed members
    If people have to watch video messages in church then they will probably end up watching them at home instead. Or someone else's videos.

  2. The Following User Says Thank You to Colonel For This Useful Post:

    Ezekiel 33 (02-19-2020)

  3. #22
    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Oslo, Norway
    Posts
    14,487
    Thanked: 5793
    Quote Originally Posted by Jew and Greek View Post
    I don't know if that was directed at me but I don't glorify the house church concept. I'm just saying that there's no particular biblical way to do church. The church started off at the Temple because they were all Jewish and had nowhere else to meet at the time. As they became more organized they met in houses and that lasted until the 3rd century. I'm not a big fan of the multi-campus video feed model and I've never attended a house church. Some of my fondest memories of church were singing in a choir in an AG church in the 70s where the Spirit was free to move. But millions of people are blessed by house churches and multi-campus churches. Let the Spirit lead where He will.
    That wasn't directed at you personally, it's just that there are lots of people who are into house churches being the only proper model. There's nothing that suggests that the Jewish believers wouldn't have assembled in the temple and in the synagogues if they hadn't been persecuted away from those places. The God fearing uncircumcised Gentiles were allowed to assemble in the synagogues, just in their own compartment, so having a mixed church assemble in a synagogue was also possible. I'm sure there are examples from the 2nd and 3rd centuries where they assembled in larger buildings like the school of Tyrannus, at least in larger cities and at times when a lack of severe persecution allowed for it.

  4. The Following User Says Thank You to Colonel For This Useful Post:

    Ezekiel 33 (02-19-2020)

  5. #23
    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Oslo, Norway
    Posts
    14,487
    Thanked: 5793
    Quote Originally Posted by LionHeart View Post
    My main question was is there a scriptural need for a spiritual father or mother to be present in the direct development of their sons and daughters ? Some have claimed people as their spiritual fathers and mothers with whom they never have had a personal relationship or have even seen in person. I do not think you can impart fully into someones life unless you are physically present to lay hands on, counsel, ect. Some of these campus churches(if not all) would fold up and close without life support from the mother church. So they are not even self supporting or independent two main goals of most church planting models. I think as with many church practices and doctrinal deviations over the years eventually they fail.Then they are cast aside as unworkable and not producing good fruit. Time will tell if this model is an unbiblical model doomed to fail ?
    Each campus needs a strong pastor but that doesn't preclude having a senior pastor overseeing all the campuses. Paul gave instructions to Titus and Timothy who in turn travelled regions where they oversaw a number of churches in the process. How much authority they had is a good question but it was certainly more than none.

  6. The Following User Says Thank You to Colonel For This Useful Post:

    Ezekiel 33 (02-19-2020)

  7. #24
    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Oslo, Norway
    Posts
    14,487
    Thanked: 5793
    Quote Originally Posted by LionHeart View Post
    Reminds me of a Smith Wigglesworth quote when he asked someone if they would be in church on Sunday ? They replied they would be there "in spirit". Smith said it would be nice if those many who told him that same thing would have there bodies show up also !
    I'm talking about something more serious, Paul's presence was real :

    1 Cor 5:3 For I indeed, as absent in body but present in spirit, have already judged (as though I were present) him who has so done this deed.
    4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when you are gathered together, along with my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ,
    5 deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

  8. The Following User Says Thank You to Colonel For This Useful Post:

    Ezekiel 33 (02-19-2020)

  9. #25
    Twenty-Two Problems with Multi-site Churches
    Article
    10.01.2014
    I love my gospel-loving friends in multi-site churches—both leaders and members! But as Christians we work continually to reform our churches in light of Scripture. So I trust a little push back on the multi-site structure serves everyone, assuming my concerns turn out to be valid. Below are 22 misgivings I have about the multi-site model. All of these apply to churches that use a video preacher. Over half apply to churches who employ a preacher on every campus.*

    1. There's no clear example of a multi-site church in the New Testament, only supposition. "Well, surely, the Christians in a city could not have all met..." (but see Acts 2:46; 5:12; 6:2).

    2. If a church is constituted by the preaching of the Word and the distribution of the ordinances under the binding authority of the keys, every "campus" where those activities transpire is actually a church. "Multi-site church" is a misnomer. It's a collection of churches under one administration.

    3. For every additional multi-site campus out there, there's one less preaching pastor being raised up for the next generation.

    4. What effectively unites the churches (campuses) of a multi-site church are a budget, a pastor's charisma, and brand identity. Nowhere does the Bible speak of building church unity in budgets, charisma, and brand.

    5. To say that the unity of the church (i.e. the unity of the campuses) depends on the leaders is to say that that the life and work of the church depends that much more on the leaders. Members, in comparison to a single-site model, are demoted.

    6. To the extent that a multi-site church relies on brand identity to reach unbelievers, to that same extent they are building Christianity on their brand identity.

    7. Multi-site churches which use video preaching unwittingly communicate that singing is more significant for Christian growth and closer to the heart of worship than hearing God's preached Word. After all, how many multi-site churches stream their music over video from a central location? A church wouldn't dare import the music, it's thought. People need to engage with a live band. People need their music authentic, personal, enfleshed. But preaching? Apparently, it can be imported from afar.

    8. When a multi-site pastor implodes, dies, or retires, all the churches that constitute that "church" are put at risk, including all the smaller once-independent congregations that the multi-site franchise took over.

    9. A multi-site church formally removes the concept of "assembly" from the definition of "church" since it's a "church" that never actually assembles (but see 1 Cor. 11:18). This is what it means to be multi-site. As such, members of a multi-site church never need to gather in order to be a church. One might say they should gather for reasons of prudence. But it's not a formal requirement of being a "church." A multi-site church could spread its 97 members (for example) across 2 sites or 97 sites. Further...

    10. Wise and sensible pastors of multi-site churches will not follow the logic of a multi-site model to its rational conclusion, but will continue to insist on some gathering for reasons of prudence and even biblical obedience (though doing so contradicts their formal definition of "church"). Unwise pastors and members, however, willfollow the multi-site logic to this conclusion by creating the opportunity for "Internet churches," unchurched "fellowship," and other forms of churchless Christianity.

    11. A multi-site church separates authority from the people with whom you gather. Authority and relationships are pulled apart. So a multi-site church involves exercising oversight and discipline over people with whom you never gather.

    12. A multi-site church makes it extremely difficult, if not impossible, for a congregation to fulfill its obligation to exercise the keys over the whole "church."

    13. Insofar as the main teacher belongs to a different gathering, a multi-site church separates the ministry of the word from the ministry of deeds.

    14. Not only does a multi-site pastor possess all the administrative power that a bishop possesses over churches in his region, he possess even more power than a bishop because he's doing all the preaching in all those churches.

    15. The multi-site church model depends upon extending the reach of "my" church rather than partnering with and aiding other congregations. That is, it's built on a competitive model of franchise extension, rather than a partnering model of mutual aid that we see in the New Testament. All this can foment "turfyness" and competition between churches. At the very least, every additional campus is a missed opportunity for helping another ministry.

    16. The pastor of a large church has difficulty knowing all his members, but he can at least have some sense of the room in which he's preaching. Both of these are impossible by definition in a multi-site church that employs video preaching.

    17. Multi-site churches make it easier to be an anonymous Christian/church member, and perhaps easier for wolves to hide. Yes, this is true of larger churches also, but now the anonymity is built into the very structures. A person can bounce between campuses—church hop!—all in the same "church."

    18. Multi-site churches make church discipline at best more difficult and at worst impossible, as an excommunicated member could easily just switch "campuses" without anyone noticing.

    19. Multi-site pours gas on the fire of "theotainment," as members receive the Word of God from a disembodied man on a screen.

    20. In an age which wants authenticity and reality, multi-site is ironically anti-incarnational: it divides Word from flesh.

    21. If every local church is to be a presentation or expression or picture of the universal church, that unbelievably wonderful end-time assembly of all God's people, the multi-site church pictures a divided end-time assembly.

    22. Multi-site churches are the current trend in evangelicalism. The great question is, will they be able to make a generational transition? Will they be able to hold together when the main preaching pastor—who is usually in himself the center of gravity for the whole enterprise—goes off the scene? And how much institutional and spiritual fall-out will occur when he does? The only examples of "multi-site churches" that have survived trans-generationally are those which invest a particular office with theological significance, as in, "The man who holds this office is the Successor of Peter, the Vicar of Christ on Earth, the Supreme Pontiff of the Church, and you owe him your allegiance regardless of whether or not you like his preaching." Whether our own evangelical brand of "multi-site churches" can make this transition without that kind of absolute claim seems unlikely.

    *Multi-site "churches" that employ preaching pastors at every site or campus are in fact a type of presbytery: a group of churches united under one elder board (and for those multi-siters who call themselves "congregational," it might be worth recalling that presbyterians vote on their pastors and, in some cases, discipline, too). Not all the points above apply to this species of the multi-site animal. I would say that points 1, 2, 4, 5, 6, 9, 10, 11, 12, 15, 17, 18, and 21 apply, though shades of a few others may apply as well. My misgivings with presbyterianism would require another list.

    Author's note: Several of the points above were provided by Alex Duke, Jamie Dunlop, Grant Gaines, and Greg Gilbert.

    By Jonathan Leeman

  10. The Following User Says Thank You to LionHeart For This Useful Post:

    Ezekiel 33 (02-19-2020)

  11. #26
    14. Not only does a multi-site pastor possess all the administrative power that a bishop possesses over churches in his region, he possess even more power than a bishop because he's doing all the preaching in all those churches.

  12. The Following User Says Thank You to LionHeart For This Useful Post:

    Ezekiel 33 (02-19-2020)

  13. #27
    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Oslo, Norway
    Posts
    14,487
    Thanked: 5793
    Quote Originally Posted by LionHeart View Post
    14. Not only does a multi-site pastor possess all the administrative power that a bishop possesses over churches in his region, he possess even more power than a bishop because he's doing all the preaching in all those churches.
    Is that common, that a senior pastor does all the preaching at all the campuses ?

  14. The Following User Says Thank You to Colonel For This Useful Post:

    Ezekiel 33 (02-19-2020)

  15. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel View Post
    Is that common, that a senior pastor does all the preaching at all the campuses ?
    Yes, it is piped in via the internet. Sometimes live but mostly recorded. The campus Pastor gets to team preach once a month. They do a sermon together of the Pastor's. The lead Pastor may come once every six months to preach on a mid week service night.

  16. The Following User Says Thank You to LionHeart For This Useful Post:

    Ezekiel 33 (02-19-2020)

  17. #29
    Dd and her family are part of a multi-site church. One thing to consider is that they do have the small group meeting concept on a weekly basis. A high percentage of churches that are not multi-site use the small group model.

  18. The Following User Says Thank You to curly sue For This Useful Post:

    Ezekiel 33 (02-19-2020)

  19. #30
    Senior Member Smitty's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Location
    Everett, Washington
    Posts
    1,629
    Thanked: 1786
    Blog Entries
    1
    I went to a church back in the early 2000's which at the time there was the home church 50 miles away from the second church which they purchased.
    The pastor would preach at both Sunday services via helicopter to make it happen. He would alternate every other Sunday night service, and would drive his car to the Sunday night service to the north location where I attended. It worked out fine because we were getting a "real live founding pastor" at the services instead of some video feed up on a screen. I myself would not go to a "video feed" campus church. But if people are getting saved, healed, and delivered at these type of churches, well, "Glory to God."
    If you put God First, you have Him at Last.

  20. The Following User Says Thank You to Smitty For This Useful Post:

    Ezekiel 33 (02-19-2020)

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
You can stop worrying about unexpected, expensive repair costs with an extended service plan for your Volkswagen. Many vehicle repairs can cost thousands of dollars in unexpected expense, now may be the time to consider an extended service plan for your vehicle.