Page 4 of 11 FirstFirst ... 23456 ... LastLast
Results 31 to 40 of 102

Thread: Legitimate grounds for having an abortion?

  1. #31
    Senior Member Lively Stone's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    252
    Thanked: 267
    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel View Post
    I will address your posts that amount to replies to mine according to what those posts actually contain, thank you.
    A very wise decision, there, Colonel.

  2. The Following User Says Thank You to Lively Stone For This Useful Post:

    FresnoJoe (09-27-2015)

  3. #32
    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Oslo, Norway
    Posts
    14,482
    Thanked: 5788
    Quote Originally Posted by Quest View Post
    Same argument the world gives in support of abortion...genocide was a reality in the OT for the sake of eventually having the savior make entrance into the earth..if it was God's Nature then He would still support it..He would be telling Christians to destroy Islam...instead He says love your enemies..

    AS for the potion

    Some translations say miscarry and others do not...21 Then the kohen shall put the isha under oath with the oath of the curse, and the kohen shall say unto the isha, Hashem make thee an alah (curse) and a shevu’ah (oath) among thy people, when Hashem doth make thy thigh to waste away, and thy belly to swell;


    It makes more sense to me that this passage is not speaking of abortion...if the woman was adulterous and not pregnant there would be no physical response...

    Wikipedia states, " "Her belly swells first and then her thigh ruptures and she dies".[12] Others maintain that since the word "thigh" is often used in the Bible as a euphemism for various reproductive organs, in this case it may mean the uterus, the placenta or an embryo, and the woman would survive.[13][14][15]"

    Since the term thigh fall and belly swell does not translate miscarriage anywhere else in the scriptures assuming it does here is a stretch...especially since there are ZERO other passages confirming that or even referencing this event at all...

    So no...killing an innocent has no Biblical justification...and does not fit the character of our almighty and all powerful God..

    IF the woman was NOT pregnant there would have been no PROOF...Wikipedia said the potion curse could carry over into several years so historically it seems it was a physical curse on the woman herself..
    I didn't say anything about that passage, I was addressing the fact that the law of Moses institutes the death penalty for a large number of crimes including adultery and there are no exceptions made for pregnant women, not even to give birth to the child first before being executed.

  4. The Following User Says Thank You to Colonel For This Useful Post:

    FresnoJoe (09-27-2015)

  5. #33
    Super Moderator Quest's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Ashville, Alabama
    Posts
    5,920
    Thanked: 3402
    Blog Entries
    2
    Another one pro abortionist use is Exodus 21:22-23

    22“If people are fighting and hit a pregnant woman and she gives birth prematurely but there is no serious injury, the offender must be fined whatever the woman’s husband demands and the court allows. 23But if there is serious injury, you are to take life for life, 24eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, 25burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise.

    I believe 'there is no serious injury' means the child and the mother are not seriously injured...some translations say miscarry but again even then that phrase cannot be ignored or interpreted..miscarries a dead baby...and since it's not really a baby there is no serious punishment...

    The passage says two men fight ant the woman get's injured and miscarries yet there is not serious injury...but if there is payment should be a life for a life.

  6. The Following User Says Thank You to Quest For This Useful Post:

    FresnoJoe (09-27-2015)

  7. #34
    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Oslo, Norway
    Posts
    14,482
    Thanked: 5788
    Quote Originally Posted by Lively Stone View Post
    A very wise decision, there, Colonel.
    A what ? I didn't change anything.

  8. The Following User Says Thank You to Colonel For This Useful Post:

    FresnoJoe (09-27-2015)

  9. #35
    Senior Member Lively Stone's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    252
    Thanked: 267
    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel View Post
    A what ? I didn't change anything.

  10. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Lively Stone For This Useful Post:

    FresnoJoe (09-27-2015), Quest (09-22-2015)

  11. #36
    Super Moderator Quest's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Ashville, Alabama
    Posts
    5,920
    Thanked: 3402
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel View Post
    I didn't say anything about that passage, I was addressing the fact that the law of Moses institutes the death penalty for a large number of crimes including adultery and there are no exceptions made for pregnant women, not even to give birth to the child first before being executed.
    Sorry, I was reminded of that passage ...you are right..so maybe the best option would be to execute all women guilty of sexual sin instead of allowing them to kill the babies they conceive...you do have a point...there does not seem to be an exception and my guess is because she was supposed to be executed right away..

    I find it ironic that where God said women should be put to death for their sin, today women say the child should be..

  12. The Following User Says Thank You to Quest For This Useful Post:

    FresnoJoe (09-27-2015)

  13. #37
    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Oslo, Norway
    Posts
    14,482
    Thanked: 5788
    Quote Originally Posted by Quest View Post
    Sorry, I was reminded of that passage ...you are right..so maybe the best option would be to execute all women guilty of sexual sin instead of allowing them to kill the babies they conceive...you do have a point...there does not seem to be an exception and my guess is because she was supposed to be executed right away..

    I find it ironic that where God said women should be put to death for their sin, today women say the child should be..
    If God had been adamant that no unborn child should ever have to die then he would have made provisions for that sort of thing, making pregnant women exempt from the death penalty at least until they give birth. I think the reason why people are so adamant about that is because they perceive the child to be completely innocent and therefore it should not have to suffer under any circumstance. But that simply means that when the child dies it goes to heaven so that line of thinking doesn't really make sense. It is robbed of the opportunity to live a life and to make a difference to others but purely for its own sake the damage done isn't enormous.

    If we compare the above to the scenario where one has to choose between the life of the mother and the life of the child (still very applicable in the rural third world where they aren't necessarily that able to save the mother's life but they are able to abort the baby to save the mother) then the effect of imposing this death penalty on the mother for being pregnant with a child that will kill her may be that she will die and go to hell whereas the child would go to heaven if it had died instead.

    If we compound this with pregnancy due to rape we get an effective death penalty for the mother for first being raped then for having to give birth to the resulting child in the face of her inevitable death sending her to hell.

    Is that possible ? Yes it is. I'd like to see anyone here demand that that mother should not be allowed to abort her baby. In real life that is. Not in some thread on some forum somewhere on the internet.

  14. The Following User Says Thank You to Colonel For This Useful Post:

    FresnoJoe (09-27-2015)

  15. #38
    Super Moderator Quest's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Ashville, Alabama
    Posts
    5,920
    Thanked: 3402
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel View Post
    If God had been adamant that no unborn child should ever have to die then he would have made provisions for that sort of thing, making pregnant women exempt from the death penalty at least until they give birth. I think the reason why people are so adamant about that is because they perceive the child to be completely innocent and therefore it should not have to suffer under any circumstance. But that simply means that when the child dies it goes to heaven so that line of thinking doesn't really make sense. It is robbed of the opportunity to live a life and to make a difference to others but purely for its own sake the damage done isn't enormous.

    If we compare the above to the scenario where one has to choose between the life of the mother and the life of the child (still very applicable in the rural third world where they aren't necessarily that able to save the mother's life but they are able to abort the baby to save the mother) then the effect of imposing this death penalty on the mother for being pregnant with a child that will kill her may be that she will die and go to hell whereas the child would go to heaven if it had died instead.

    If we compound this with pregnancy due to rape we get an effective death penalty for the mother for first being raped then for having to give birth to the resulting child in the face of her inevitable death sending her to hell.

    Is that possible ? Yes it is. I'd like to see anyone here demand that that mother should not be allowed to abort her baby. In real life that is. Not in some thread on some forum on the internet.
    You can argue that point....don't know that it would stand in His court...that was an execution, not a willful murder of a mother's unborn baby..

    One could also argue that before Christ all were lost anyway..all were condemned already...

  16. The Following User Says Thank You to Quest For This Useful Post:

    FresnoJoe (09-27-2015)

  17. #39
    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Oslo, Norway
    Posts
    14,482
    Thanked: 5788
    Quote Originally Posted by Quest View Post
    You can argue that point....don't know that it would stand in His court...that was an execution, not a willful murder of a mother's unborn baby..

    One could also argue that before Christ all were lost anyway..all were condemned already...
    So if someone only in-directly kills an unborn child then it is suddenly a-okay ?

  18. The Following User Says Thank You to Colonel For This Useful Post:

    FresnoJoe (09-27-2015)

  19. #40
    Super Moderator Quest's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Ashville, Alabama
    Posts
    5,920
    Thanked: 3402
    Blog Entries
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel View Post
    So if someone only in-directly kills an unborn child then it is suddenly a-okay ?
    I think I was clear...One could also argue that before Christ all were lost anyway..all were condemned already...
    A-Okay? No..but I don't understand execution for adultery either, but apparently God did..

    The ONE thing I do understand about the OT compared to the NT is that God was dealing with people that were lost whether they were people of faith or not and He had one intent and all He did was with that intent in mind...Getting Jesus here. That is the only way to reconcile that God is love and that God who IS love ordered the genocide of the Amalekites, men women, children and animals...

    But we don't live then and we DO know how the power and heart of God available to us today and He is not a God who accepts a selfish justification for taking the life of an unborn child.
    Even then the execution was not such...

  20. The Following User Says Thank You to Quest For This Useful Post:

    FresnoJoe (09-27-2015)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Avoid unexpected, expensive repair costs with an extended warranty for your Suzuki. Many vehicle repairs can cost thousands of dollars in unexpected expense, now may be the time to consider an extended service plan for your vehicle.