Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 22

Thread: I don't have to forgive them unless they repent !

  1. #1

    I don't have to forgive them unless they repent !

    Luke 17:3 So watch yourselves! "If another believer sins, rebuke that person; then if there is repentance, forgive.
    If there is repentance. If they don't repent withhold forgiveness and restoration of relationship. Pray for them and commit them to God. That's pretty simple but not what we are generally taught. We are told to forgive without any conditions whatsoever.

  2. #2
    Frozen Chosen A.J.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    8,050
    Thanked: 6091
    That verse doesn't say we don't have to forgive. Doesn't even imply it.



    Luke 17:3 So watch yourselves.
    “If your brother or sister[a] sins against you, rebuke them; and if they repent, forgive them. 4 Even if they sin against you seven times in a day and seven times come back to you saying ‘I repent,’ you must forgive them.” NIV

    Luke 17:3 Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.

    4 And if he trespass against thee seven times in a day, and seven times in a day turn again to thee, saying, I repent; thou shalt forgive him.KJV

  3. #3
    Senior Member KaySharpe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Wilmington, NC
    Posts
    286
    Thanked: 132
    Interesting. That second "if" is a conditional participle.

  4. #4
    Senior Member KaySharpe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Location
    Wilmington, NC
    Posts
    286
    Thanked: 132
    Quote Originally Posted by A.J. View Post
    That verse doesn't say we don't have to forgive. Doesn't even imply it.



    Luke 17:3 So watch yourselves.
    “If your brother or sister[a] sins against you, rebuke them; and if they repent, forgive them. 4 Even if they sin against you seven times in a day and seven times come back to you saying ‘I repent,’ you must forgive them.” NIV

    Luke 17:3 Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.

    4 And if he trespass against thee seven times in a day, and seven times in a day turn again to thee, saying, I repent; thou shalt forgive him.KJV

    A.J. I think what LH is saying is that the scripture says

    IF THIS > THEN THAT (if they sin, rebuke)
    IF THIS > THEN THAT (if they repent, forgive)

    Implying, if they don't sin, don't rebuke - and if they don't repent, don't forgive.


    I believe that taking this verse by itself, not weighing out the rest of Scripture, would lead one to conclude that forgiveness is unnecessary.

  5. #5
    Here, in Luke 17, Jesus refers to one individual sinning against another individual consciously and intentionally, even at times with malice in mind. In that situation we are to rebuke or to censure that individual, letting them know their behavior is unacceptable.
    Jesus instructs us to actually confront them, rebuke them if necessary, letting them know that they wrongly crossed our boundaries. If they desire to continue the relationship, we must require they apologize and offer some sort of assurance that it will not happen again.
    In some cases this may even require the intentional offender to make restitution.
    If they repent as a result of being lovingly but firmly rebuked, we are to restore them immediately.
    If they should make the same mistake again, realizing their error and repenting again, we are to forgive them again, no matter how frequently we must do so.
    On the other hand, if they refuse to repent for having intentionally hurt or offended us, then we must continue to walk in love toward them but avoid them and censure them.
    "Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them." (Romans 16:17)
    This way they will get the message that they have violated our reasonable boundaries. http://www.johnhamelministries.org/T...orgiveness.htm

  6. #6
    However, it is important that when we have to hold a brother or sister's feet to the fire concerning intentional wrongdoing, we harbor no ill-will in our hearts towards them whatsoever.

    We must willingly release all bitterness and resentment. We are to treat them with respect and dignity, but Jesus said we are not to forgive them, meaning restore them, until they repent and begin to do whatever is necessary to restore the trust they have broken.

    Two Kinds of Forgiveness
    Knowledge Avoids Confusion & Injustice
    by Pastor John Hamel

  7. The Following User Says Thank You to LionHeart For This Useful Post:

    Valiant Woman (04-30-2016)

  8. #7
    Frozen Chosen A.J.'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    8,050
    Thanked: 6091
    Quote Originally Posted by LionHeart View Post
    However, it is important that when we have to hold a brother or sister's feet to the fire concerning intentional wrongdoing, we harbor no ill-will in our hearts towards them whatsoever.

    We must willingly release all bitterness and resentment. We are to treat them with respect and dignity, but Jesus said we are not to forgive them, meaning restore them, until they repent and begin to do whatever is necessary to restore the trust they have broken.

    Two Kinds of Forgiveness
    Knowledge Avoids Confusion & Injustice
    by Pastor John Hamel
    Now that, I can't argue with, which was going to be my next post.

  9. The Following User Says Thank You to A.J. For This Useful Post:

    Valiant Woman (04-30-2016)

  10. #8
    Administrator fuego's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Posts
    16,274
    Thanked: 14133
    Blog Entries
    1
    The thing is we can't take it out of context with the rest of the scripture. It doesn't say that when taking the rest of scripture into consideration.

    For instance:

    Mark 11
    25 And when ye stand praying, forgive, if ye have ought against any: that your Father also which is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses.
    26 But if ye do not forgive, neither will your Father which is in heaven forgive your trespasses.

    To use the "if" in Luke to extrapolate that if they don't ask forgiveness then we don't have to forgive is unscriptural when taking the scripture as a whole.

  11. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to fuego For This Useful Post:

    A.J. (04-23-2016), Femme* (04-24-2016), Valiant Woman (04-30-2016)

  12. #9
    Senior Member Colonel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Location
    Oslo, Norway
    Posts
    14,487
    Thanked: 5793
    Forgive can mean various things just like fear can. The Bible both tells us to serve God without fear and to have fear of God.

  13. #10
    Administrator fuego's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Posts
    16,274
    Thanked: 14133
    Blog Entries
    1
    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel View Post
    Forgive can mean various things just like fear can. The Bible both tells us to serve God without fear and to have fear of God.
    Example on how forgive can mean different things and relating it to the subject at hand?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Be prepared for breakdowns with an extended service plan for your Honda. Many vehicle repairs can cost thousands of dollars in unexpected expense, now may be the time to consider an extended service plan for your Honda, including the Honda Accord.